Joe and Spencer — Part Two

I was considering writing my final post of 2016 on things to look forward to in 2017. However, I felt it would be somewhat repetitive in nature. New announcements from any of the companies mentioned in the 5 bullet points in this post are the most important things to look out for in 2017 and I did not want to repeat that information here.

Allergan and Samumed are also of significant interest to the hair loss world. Various other lesser known usually newer companies involved in clinical trials and/or new hair loss related drug development are also worth keeping an eye out for, although some are receiving a level of publicity way beyond what they currently warrant. e.g., this record 314 (and counting) page thread about a somewhat unproven product is insane.

And finally, the 5-10 major regional and global hair and/or stem cell related conferences are always of interest every year including in 2017. We should all also be watching out for CRISPR and gene modification related conferences hereon.

But to end this year, I wanted to find something else to write about that was unique, not repetitive, and not too technical/scientific in nature. Something you can read on your phone screen on New Year’s Eve while drunk and out in the cold waiting for things to happen. After some consternation and difficulties in deciding on what to write about, lo and behold, Joe Tillman (formerly known as Jotronic) and Spencer Stevenson (more widely known as Spex) unknowingly came to the rescue. To learn more about both these hair legends, please read my original post on them.

Joe’s 25,000 Transplanted Hair Follicles

First, earlier today Joe Tillman released an excellent and very instructive video for those who are thinking of getting a hair transplant. I did not realize that he has had 25,000 (!) hair follicles moved from the back of his scalp to the front and crown of his scalp over the years (in 9 separate surgeries including one scar revision).

Note that “follicles” is different from “follicular units” or “grafts”. Joe’s transformation has been very impressive and he is very honest about all the pros and cons of his “new” transplanted hair. I still cannot believe his before and after hair transplant transformation considering that his first two bad hair transplants occurred almost 24 years ago. FYI — click on the title of the below video to open in a separate page.

Spex Joins the Dutasteride Bandwagon

I have mentioned Spencer (Spex) a few times on this blog before. He has had around 10 (!) large and small hair transplants over the years and is featured in numerous newspaper stories about hair loss. I was very pleased to learn that he very recently started using Dutasteride to treat his hair loss. He is documenting his results with photos here.

I have discussed Dutasteride (original brand name = Avodart) numerous times on this blog. It is basically Finasteride (original brand name = Propecia) on steroids. More benefits as well as more side effects than Finasteride. There are quite a few internet testimonials that you can find of old men who got on Dutasteride (to treat enlarged prostates) and saw hair growing on parts of their scalp that were bald for decades. Something that is extremely hard to do. You can also read about some great positive results (as well as failures) of using Dutasteride to treat hair loss in the comments to this post.

When Avodart first came out onto the market in 2002 (after FDA approval at the end of 2001), hair loss forum members all over the world were going berserk with excitement. I miss those days when it seem liked Dutasteride was the ultimate cure for hair loss. Everyone was counting the days till the pending product release with extreme levels of hope and hysteria. Unfortunately, the drug was not a miracle for most people who already had significant hair loss.

So instead of, here I am talking about :-(

Happy Holidays Everyone!

84 thoughts on “Joe and Spencer — Part Two”

  1. Good news that spex is on Avodart, i can see his crown is starting to thin there, this will make duta more accepted in the hairloss community. But what im really interested in is my theory if combatting duta side effects with AI (aromatase inhibitors). Im willing to experiment with AI but my problem is that duta isnt giving me any negative side effects. hope you too look into it admin

  2. @Admin
    You say “somewhat unproven product is insane.” About Brotzu lotion. But can you give me other tratment who show real person recover fron 100% AA to terminal hair like the kid?I not talking about PowerPoint , graph or joke picturess like histogen or Rivertwon.
    The doctor say that will work in AGA to. And will be the ONLY thing possible to exit in 2017. So if we get this to the market will be something new in 20 o more years. Is not to be happy about?

  3. Very interesting video from Joe and his transplant has turned out wonderful…I will get a hair transplant in 2018 if no major news in 2017 from Folica and Histogen.

    1. Id do the same, but hiw the hell do you go out in public and WORK during that very ugly 3-4 month phase?! It looks gross and looks unacceptable to look like that if you have a real job where you interact with important people. Like, its 10 times uglier than a nice clean 1/2 (attachment) shave, your scalp is all red and hair looks terrible with some ingrown hairs a gross folliculitus. Do they do this in between jobs or something?? Serious, how do they time this?

  4. I am pretty hopeful about the Brotzu potion. The explanation and story of how he came to develop it seem very feasible to me. I hope Fidia’s trial will show promising results and they will be able to produce it on a large scale. If it does what they say it does that’s close to a perfect treatment for me as being in early stages of hair loss that isn’t too aggressive.

    I am pretty jealous that Spex feels side effect free for finasteride because it wasn’t that way for me, even though I could tell it was working for me even at a micro dose of 0.1mg daily.

    To be honest I think Joe Tillman would have looked fine if he clipped his hair and never started with transplants. I hope I never go that far trying to save my hair, it seems silly to me to go through so much trouble to get a comb over in the end. Two guys at work have had hair transplants and having seen their results I think I’d look and feel better just clipping it and investing in good skin care. Spex on the other hand looks amazing to me and even though I would shudder to think at all the money and time he spent on it, I understand why it’s worth it to him.

    1. @imho I am optimistic as well. I believe it will be a good treatment for young guys/low Norwoods. My expectations are tame. If the lotion can completely halt hair loss, while giving some decent regrowth (personally, I only need about 1-1.5cm back on my hairline and nobody will be even able to tell I’ve receded a bit) and I will be very happy.

      Obviously this lotion most likely won’t be able to return NW7s to NW1s, but improving a NW scale or two and being able to maintain that would be absolutely huge for millions of people, basically to the point of being a functional cure.

  5. No more baldness.

    2017 JAK treats normal pattern hair loss.
    2017 JAK is The cure (treatment).
    2017 the Year of Hair Rising Again.

    Now I’ve got to buy hair brushes Jan. 1st and conditioners. Letting my hair grow a bit long for 2 years then I will wear it short.

    Happy New Year.

    1. Your blind, unwavering faith in JAK inhibitors is so perplexing. Even if they do work for AGA, which of course there is 0 evidence of, we’re still several years at best away from them coming to market as a MPB treatment. Why? Well because he possible cancer-related side effects are a gigantic obstacle that you don’t seem to want to recognize. JAK works tremendously well for AA and yet it is still not a commercially available treatment. Tell me NASA, why do you think that is?

      1. Everyone’s hands have to be greased before they come out with any type of treatment. Remember hair loss research funds pretty much everything except hair loss research.

        There have been PROVEN albeit extremely rare cases that almost conclusively shows that JAK should work for normal pattern hair loss. The Beno two guys, took an experimental drug and regrew hair as thick on top as it was on the side. They were sun worshippers and one guy had a bad sun burn.

        My thought, it gave the drug time to saturate the mid level skin layers thus it worked in a different way than just taking it orally. Same thing with the campfire guy. Old guy fell head first into a campfire and regrew his hair (had photos of before and after). It was not mentioned that he was on an arthritis drug but he was old thus probably was on something. Not conclusive but it lends evidence that normal pattern hair loss sufferers CAN regrow their hair inspite of the muscle pillar issue. Even Dr. Christiano thinks there is a good chance of working.

        It is not certainty but extremely possible, especially how agressively JAK Rux grows hair on AA sufferers. It gets the hair cycle going again. Guess what, that’s what we need the hair cycle going again. It will work.

        Stop being so pessimistic. Tsumi (sp?) and the others are decades away. JAK is here NOW and FDA Aprroved, and PROVEN to work at least on AA. That’s not good enough? Need complete proof? Then wait for Aclaris trials then you will have your proof.

        2017 it will be proven that JAK works on normal pattern hair loss. I am not sure how long after that until it comes out on the market but better believe what will happen. Enough about the past we are in 2017 with the solution.

        2017 Slam Dunk.

        My opinion of course.


        1. “There have been PROVEN albeit extremely rare cases that almost conclusively shows that JAK should work for normal pattern hair loss. ”

          Show me 1. One!

      1. LOL it takes 11 years for a pre-clinical drug to make it to market, on average. NASA thinks it will happen for a potentially carcinogenic compound in 6 months. That’s straight up delusional.

        1. It’s already FDA approved! It’s already on the market!

          Just need to know how to saturate hair follicles at lower skin levels and to know if it works when that happens.

          1. Why doesn’t aclaris post that it looks like they are gearing up for a long 3 phase trials through their pipeline page

    2. Jak work only for AA. Not in AGA. Tópic or oral, systemic or local. And in AA is to Toxic. But i AM OK we people thinking other thing….
      In the Next 2 years Brotzu os the only hope . Sad but true.

      Really? And why for AA is nothing in the market ?You will wait all 2017 for that Jak…… Lol

      1. Susana don’t say JAK won’t work like you know its fact, Christiano is very smart and is confident it will work for AGA. Not to mention in a recent presentation pitch to other investors one of Aclaris employees stated everything is going well as expected with JAK with AGA. So stop insulting people for being optimistic because you’re a buzz kill. Leave Nasa alone, let him be optimistic about what he wants ffs. He’s not hurting you is he.

  6. Here is my psychic gift for us all happy new years
    Ommm mmm

    2017. Shiseido will have moderate results hide them till winter 2018 after over hyping

    Histogen will announce their delayed Mexican opening

    Follica will be suspensefullying silent

    Kelopesia will be released and totally suck

    Fidia will release Italy the before and afters will not be exciting enough to smuggle over seas

    Follicum will release positive claims

    Kythera will scrap setpiprant

    Bitmotoprost. Lol jk

    Aclaris will continue releasing Nasa’s mix tapes and begin phase 1 in the fall with no word out for the year.

    Clinica will release positive data but still seem too sketchy to get behind.

    Riken will continue smugly not giving a damn because they have the royal flush

    Hairclone will add more scientist and begin storing. With zero to little financing.

    Rivertown will post incredible before and afters from a rogaine patient in the 90s

    Thorn Medical will announce they cured mpb again and will continue as vague and sketchy as possible while they buy more bahamian medical real estate. By winter announcing their dropping everything to become a bahamian real estate company called Thorn Carribean.

    Admin hears back from Boston and gets positive news.

    Crispr actually starats curing disease in humans.

    Thank you that took a lot of mana your welcome

    1. I don’t think your post is unrealistic. It’s always another 5-10 years away. I do think that 6 years or so seems reasonable but I’m already pretty old. FML :P I’ll just continue on DUT which I’ve been on half a year or so. I can’t really say if it’s helped much… Looking at hair transplant #2 in the next month or so.

  7. I wish spex the best of luck, but ive been on dutasteride for a year and 4 months and recently switched to 5mg dut and havent been getting any relief in itch, hair loss or sebum.

    My next option is a transplant, but my loss is just not possible to stop, hopefully it works out.

    Have a good new years guys !

  8. Joe’s hair looks really good and I would be very pleased to have that. Spex’s hair seems naturally very thick if you check his site so his transplant looks even better.

  9. @The comments in this post….Are you kidding people with MPB? it’s pathetic. Now dutasteride….@Sogosowhat: You don’t have nothing to do here…Not because you post more here people are going to buy Dutasteride….

    @Khrourii: I do not comment on what is obvious.

    1. This post is about avodart. And avodart is the best medicine, no doubt whatsoever. You seen the other thread, lots of guys on futasteride with no bad side effects. Sorry the truth hurt you then (actually im not sorry).

      1. Ive been on avodar for a year and 4 months and at 5mg for a while now.. it isnt “the best medicine” at all. Im still receding hard, still shedding hard, still itching hard..

        1. Yes i seen you mentioning it in other comments, you have to admit youre not a typical case, your symptoms are rare and serious.
          I assume youre using genuine avodart.

  10. @Sogowowhat: In the other thread? Who? You and your friends and Spex of course. Avodart is the best medicine? Don’t make me laugh…commercial…
    Sexual effects including erectile dysfunction and decreased libido and ejaculate were reported in as many as 3.4 to 15.8 percent of men. Nobody wants this…Dutasteride: Finasteride in steroids: Sorry. Don’t waste your time. Another companies work very hard to give you a better treatment. The time is over for oral antiandrogens.
    What madness. Take hormones … for a pathology where DHT is not the main cause.


    1. DHT is not the main cause or we’d have a cure. But these drugs can at least slow the process with more appreciable side effects when compared to cyclosporin A. I’d use it if there were a safe topical dosage.. hopefully Rivertown Therapeutics is onto something.

      1. Have you seen the photos of zzzz after just under 2 months? Slowing the process?? Everyone want to focus on side effects and those who fail, and chose to ignore the majority with no bad sides and many good results, plus a few really great results.

    2. So up to 96.6% didnt have sexual side effects, thats great news, i will remember to quote you on that in future comments. Once again proof that im a quite typical responder to dut, works wonders and no negative sides.

      1. 15,8 per cent of men. The time for oral antiandrogens is over. New treatments for MPB with another pathways are coming very soon. Accept it. It’s easy.

        1. Dutasteride is here and its working for me at $1 per day, why wait 10 years for a treatment that cost nearly 6 digits. Heres an idea: you wait, you will be disappointed, i go on enjoy life, i will not be disappointed. Sounds like a great deal for me, and for you too since youll probably gonna write this one down as a great victory over me, me who am only a delusional victim of 5ari abuse who dont know my own best. Yep, i can almost feel it, you really owned me there, put me in my place you did :)

          1. I wait? I work for it! Mother of god…Dutasteride is not going to succeed as a treatment for androgenetic alopecia I’m very sorry for you. Remember it. Another pathways are working very well for MPB. Great deal for you? Of course. DHT is not the main cause of MPB. Why you don’t understand that…? You know it. In 2017/2018 all of you will have a new treatment for MPB. Androgenetic alopecia is untreated and unattended. Companies know that you can be sure…:)

            1. Told you, big victory for you :) I have a medicine that really regrows im bald areas, gives me beneficial sideeffects, feeling great, looking better too – not subjective but according to girls half my age, my new GF i met last week is 19, what a disaster, im so screwed up by dutasteride, pls save me Paul…

  11. 2017 The Year of Hair Rising!

    JAK already FDA approved and ALREADY on the market.

    Just need to know how to saturate lower skin levels and if it works when that happens. JAK turns on the hair cycle that’s why it works for AA. Guess what, it will work for us.

    Normal pattern hair loss will be proven to be treatable.

    2017 Hair Rising!

    1. Tofacitinib (or any other JAKi)
      CB-03-01 (Breezula)
      PGE2 (or Bimatoprost)

      Slap them on your scalp and you’ll soon be whippin’ people or destroying buildings with your long carbon hair. Have a nice ride into the New Year!

    2. I hope you are right nasa.
      Despite the fact that Christiano sold jak without further examining its potential…I really hope 2017 is the year i start spending less time in the bathroom trying to cover up bald spots.

      1. Christianity did the absolutely the best thing for us. She sold the Rights to a well financed $600 million market cap firm that is exclusively researching and coming out with products related to skin conditions. It’s a Perfect Match. In fact they are working on coming out with products both oral and topical for AA hair loss.

        1. If they make the topical version for AA and release them to the market soon, we won’t need to wait for them to finish trials for AGA :) That is, if it actually works topically for AGA, which I really hope for!

      2. I’m kind of glad she sold it to another company. I think if Christiano had kept working on it without Aclaris she wouldn’t have been that much into AGA research. In her interviews and statements she seems to care more about every other baldness. Like everyone who isn’t bald they don’t call it a disease or a problem because they don’t get it. I class AGA as a disease. It doesn’t look good whatsoever and it eats at your freedom to experiment with appearance. Very depressing :’) I’m 23 and started at 17. Lets hope Jak works like I know it will and then I can have my crown and front back -_-

    3. I’m quite optimistic about JAKs. However it’s not a matter of them being approved already for something else and simply banging them out for this now. The studies will take years before it hits the shelves. I do agree that 2017 is the year we find out. The oral version is already being tested and the topical is a few months away from entering phase1. Wouldn’t be surprised if the AGA topical enters phase1 at the same time. Either way, sometime between summer and next Christmas we should have some answers at least.

      1. I have to say, if it was a new drug it would be years as they’d need to iron all the facts out. But I can’t see it being that long considering they have different Jak for different conditions on Market. If not late this year, I’d say 2018 if it works easy! I can even live with it coming out in 2020. Long as I know it fully works and is on its way I can sleep better!

        1. Minoxidil took something like 10 years to get approved despite being on the market for other conditions. Not saying it would take that long but it won’t be overnight either. I believe it will work. Maybe not for long time slick bald areas but who knows. We’ll know later this year. I’d say best case scenario is hitting the market 2019-2020. But ppl will find ways to get it compounded off label before then most likely.. if they can afford it. Either way we should know if it works or not in 2017… and I agree, if it does work then it makes the wait a lil easier for sure.

  12. 2017 Hair Rising! Finally!

    Go Aclaris. And anyone else but it seems only JAK will work Other than transplants or cell multiplication.

    It’s going to be a great year.

    1. Nasa, I want to just say I like you on this site. Everytime I see your comments all I see is ridicule towards you. But I tell you this, I’d rather come to a site hoping for good news and optimism than all the losers here that just attack you and others because they dare be enthusiastic. I’m going to back you on this, I think you’re 100% right about Jak. It’s just blatantly obvious to me. There is no way AGA is caused purely down to testosterone/DHT. No way. It is clearly an immune problem. Jaks clear up psoriasis and other skin issues as well as block immune system hurting the follicles in other people with other conditions, there is no reason not to be optimistic that it would cure us. When JAK is announced to work I’m coming back here to say I told all you doubters so! I’ll also give NASA a cyberspace high five because apart from the admin, he is the only one who brings somewhat a glimmer of positivity to this site. The amount of times i’ve heard people crying over “oh it’ll take YEARS” Stfu baldness is shit enough without a bunch of babies trying to bully a guy over an opinion. Leave Nasa alone and grow a pair.

      1. Do people really ‘bully’ nasa or do they disagree with him? I mean he’s all but guaranteeing that a certain compound will work for MPB even though there’s no evidence, so if he’s going to beat this drum in anticipation of the praise, he sort of opens himself up for ridicule if it doesn’t pan out. That’s just how it goes.

        Also, yes, there’s a lot more going on in AGA than just androgen sensitivity to dht, but that does NOT mean that it is an auto immune disorder. AA and AGA have very similar symptoms, but that’s all hair loss is – the symptom of an underlying condition. To declare that they thus work via the same biological mechanism is like saying that you can treat the flu the same as food poisoning just because they both cause nausea. In medicine you don’t treat the symptoms.

        I want JAKs to work as much as anyone, but at a certain point too much positivity just becomes false hope and that’s not good for anyone here.

  13. Admin, thank you for all the hair loss info during 2016! I watched the video of Joe and sensed that he is still not totally happy with his hair, especially when it comes to the crown/back.

    The worst thing is that surgeons at this moment are still very sure about their own businesses especially because they don’t seem to expect potential competitive treatments, at least not in the short term. Some are even opening new HT facilities which shows (my assumption) their confidence in the HT future.

    I just hope that most of the things Egghead stated in his teasing comment, won’t become reality. If Riken really would be the only hope on the 2020 horizon, that would exactly explain the everlasting arrogance of the HT industry.

    Lately, I haven’t checked this blog as often as I did in the beginning and mid 2016. I wish everybody all the best for 2017, most of you have been waiting way too long already to be released from this torturing AGA

    1. Here we go Roland is back again as I expected : lesson learned is don’t say somebody’s research is dead, in fact they work under the radar ; )
      Thanks Paul for the news !

  14. Happy New Year everyone! To happiness, good health, success and a freaking better treatment for hair loss! Let’s go Samumed, Follica, and Sisheido.

    HT business will never go away. They know they are in the business for at least the next 10 years. Better treatments will come but only tsuji will be able to eliminate hts. The rest of the potential treatments will be good for low to mid level norwoods. Combine those treatments with fue then it could potentially cure us. However this is just me pulling speculation out of my ass hahaha. I’m sure something better will come out very soon though. It’s been 20 years since a new treatment has been approved. even by pharmaceutical profit greed standards it’s time for something better than Rogaine foam and Propecia.

    Fingers crossed for amazing things in 2017.

    Fyi..Japan is going to be trialing anti aging drugs to it’s aging population this year. Things moving in the right direction. :)

  15. Thanks for all the info and comments though 2016. I wish you all a great 2017 and thicker hair by the end of the year

  16. happy new year people!!!
    2018 riken will start human trials for unlimited hair!
    12 months … nothing! patience!
    1 follicle= 1000 hairs
    150 follicles= full head of hair for you :)

    1. wait wait what? 2018 …? really? source please, cause I thought they planned on initiating follicle banking not already save lives in 2018… :D :D

  17. I wish tech companies can come up with a solution… Look at the cars and how they are evolving… Tesla Nikola Faraday.. All these… If they can’t fix hair loss bilogically.. Atleast a technical solution… Wish silicon Valley comes up with a solution…

    1. Thats a good find, they seem similar to Replicel, but who knows. I guess close to unlimited. It would be great if what they say is true.

  18. Thank you and happy New year Admin! I have a hair loss pattern similar to Joe though I haven’t done anything to treat it besides getting it cut shorter and shorter each time. Next time I get a haircut I might be going with a .5 or 0 on the sides and blend into the top as it is ridiculously thin on top now and I want to look as attractive as possible.

    Here’s to hoping for a new treatment that provides results dramatic enough to warrant taking it :)

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