Update: Listening to the webcast again (yes it is still available), Dr. Neal Walker clearly states that while systemic JAK inhibitors did not work for androgenetic alopecia, topical JAK inhibitors did work for androgenetic alopecia (and not just for alopecia areata)! This is huge. Thanks to commentator “Bob Ross’s Hair” for typing out the exact quote below for us:
“We will be developing a topical JAK inhibitor for androgenetic alopecia, and the data on that is quite interesting in that they found that the systemic JAK inhibitor does not work for that particular indication, but the topical does, mainly as a function of the target being more superficial in the skin and not really accessible from a systemic circulation.”
The important Jefferies 2016 Healthcare Conference is going on in New York City as I am writing this post. It started five minutes ago (12pm EST — aka NYC — time). The CEO of Aclaris Therapeutics, Dr. Neal Walker, is presenting. You can view it live via registering here. Or from here.
The best part is that 19 slides are already available to view at the top of the ongoing webcast, and Dr. Walker just mentioned that they are now more confident about JAK inhibiters and will be developing a topical version for androgenic alopecia!! One more small leap for “nasa_rs”, but will it finally translate into one giant leap for mankind?
Slide numbers 16 and 17 mention androgenic alopecia. The key March 2016 acquisition of and partnership with Dr. Angela Christiano’s Vixen Pharmaceuticals (Columbia University IP) is what seems to have spurred the optimism behind developing and testing topical JAK inhibitors on androgenic alopecia patients. Slide 16 also mentions that they are working on next generation JAK inhibitors called “covalently bound highly selective JAK3 inhibitors.”
Note that those slides and the audio webcast presentation are both supposed to soon be available on Aclaris’ website, but will only remain there for several weeks.
497 thoughts on “Jefferies 2016: Dr. Neal Walker Says Topical JAK Inhibiters will be Tested on AGA Patients”
Why no home made success with jaks for aga but some anecdotal success using jaks for aa (like that girl who was posted recently)?
Sorry to sound negative but I don’t want to get my hopes up for nothing and I don’t think jaks will work well for aga – if at all.
You think a million dollar company and respected hairloss scientists will get your hopes up for nothing?
Aclaris is 440 Mil
Is like 50/50. People like to be over exited. We all are emotional…. But we like the idea of a cure /treatment for something we dont Know 100% the cousas for AGA. But we are almost sure about the tratment….. We need to wait… For now the Best place to follow this is the AA people. I am reading a lot in alopecia world.
Just because you know a rocket can get you to the moon doesn’t mean a home made rocket will show any success. Drug science is like rocket science, leave it to the professionals to do it properly for us.
This is the most eloquent statement I’ve heard on a hair forum, possibly ever. I’ve struggled with explaining this exact sentiment. Hope you don’t mind if I cut and paste.
Exactly! Perfect analogy mate.
Thanks guys :) – Breyfogle feel free to copy & paste – I’m flattered.
what If I told u the moon landing was a hoax?
Things have definitely been moving with these JAK inhibitors….
Looks like the most promising drug to date right now…at least we will find out its potential shortly
We will see. Not bad…
The best blog about hair loss and male pattern baldness.
Thanks:-) 10 percent credit to each of the regular commentators except several crazies.
because home made ones are bullix… jak molecules are too big to penetrate into skin… different solvent needed
Good news. Thanks admin for the outstanding work from you ! The home made jak does not deliver the right mechanism to the follicle, so let’s wait and and see
exactly jak is not going under skin… so not reaching to follicle indeed
don’t worry about that donitello…. :)
Thank you Admin! I hope one day soon we can thank you by name and hoist you on our shoulders. :)
I will post my photo on this blog when I have great hair again:-)
I will finally create my FB account :)
I will finally upload my photo on facebook
Maybe a final post a Before and 6 month After Photo of all of us great looking guys.
This can’t be stopped now. Although I have no idea why their stock went down a little today – very puzzling. Maybe people have not figured things out.
Anyways. Wow. and Wow.
Admin, this are realy good news. But, there are three question:
1. When they will start will trials?
2. How long we will wait for results?
3. When we can expect comercialisation of that product?
Sorry for my english.
Thank you admin.
We will know a bit more once the slides and webcast are made available. Unfortunately I was disconnected before the presentation ended and was too busy to take more notes.
This is indeed very very interesting news:-O
Stay tuned…one more item coming later today:-)
Better then this one?
Depends on whether you value a surprise from the past more or a surprise for the future (aka this post) more.
Daphne Zohar presenting at this isn’t she? Great work as usual admin. That Neal Walker guy…he’s up to something. Can’t be a coincidence that he’s linked with Follica.
Im all tuned up admin!! :-)
They said in the presentation that topical JAK inhibitors work for AGA
Is this in text or was this in the presentation!?!?!? If they said it I really can’t say that I’m surprised that it works. After doing an enormous amount of reading over the past year or two I would’ve been shocked had JAK inhibitors had no effect AGA.
And do you guys truly think Angela Christiano had/has no idea that this works in AGA??? Get real. She knows it does in my opinion. It was a matter of getting the right deal for the IP. She studies all types of hair loss not just AA contrary to what some on this forum think. And she does it from the gene level first. If true this has been long overdue and we are almost to the finish line dealing with this.
Really? They said it works??
Could not have asked for better news But also what I expected to happen. Now let’s please get this to market soon!
Another nugget behind the science
This article talks about stat3 being present in the mitochondria of keratinocytes. Keratinocytes are what the actual hair shaft (cutical, cortex) is made from. For anyone with basic cell biology knowledge, the mitochondria is the “powerhouse” of the cell and uses up the vast majority of the cell’s energy. A key point in this article is that lowering stat3 in the mitochondria ups mitochondria gene transcription. This would lead to a higher pool of gene expression and an energetic cell which would divide easier. This could be an explanation as to why the hair cycle gets progressively shorter in AGA. The cells energy is getting depleted by mitochondrial Stat3. So yet another way in which overactivated stat3 can cause cellular problems.
Exactly Matt. Here are two links that both must be read and compared to what those two compounds from 16 years ago worked to solve AGA on SOME people and how JAK works.
MATT – can you tell how CsA and FK506 are similar to JAK’s? Remember those two old compounds worked on SOME AGA but not ALL. I wanted to find out if JAK maybe will work better.
Great finds NASA!!! I read the abstract and briefly browsed through the longer of the two. Will read the entire thing later. I cannot believe that this was that long ago and nothing has been done about it since in regards to AGA. We have been slaying the androgen receptor angle for such a long time with such little results. It doesn’t even account for 20% of the variance in AGA. And is completely monomirphic in Asians. Their AGA is entirely caused by other gene locusts…. And typically occurs on average 10 years later than Europeans. Therefore whatever the mechanism(s) getting turned on in AGA are only being excellerated by the bad androgen receptor variant in Europeans. Not directly caused by the androgen receptor. It requires ANDROGENS (specifically DHT) but does not require the specific bad receptor. BIG DIFFERENCE. Looks like AGA has a large immune system component just like AA. So many important bits of info not just in these articles… Estrogen inhibits Il-6 and Androgen (especially DHT inducible miRNA-22) stimulates it. This explains why women lose hair at menopause despite declining test levels (bc estrogen protective effect is also declining). IL6 Causes premature Catagen and is induced by DHT in dp cells. Works through stat3 which can oversensitize and over-induce Ar expression. Stat3 is also responsible for the premature cellular senescence of DP (and other cell pops… It is a cancer protection mechanism trying to shut the cell down in the presence of ROS). Overexpression of keratinocyte specific mitochondrial stat3 causes slowed gene expression in direct energy unit of cell… Thus explaining why they cannot re-enter the hair cycle after a certain threshold has been reached… They are exhausted. Loses contact from arector pili…. Stat3 mediates muscle satellite helper cell regeneration…. And too much stat3 retards the process. Stat3 is needed for dkk1 in DP which messes with the beta catenin and Wnt pathways. The information is right in front of your guys’ faces. THIS IS IT AND NASA-RS WAS SPOT ON. They have found the needle in the haystack in my opinion. It’s the same one acting in AA and graft vs host disease… Both of which have stimulated hair growth topically with JAK inhibitors. They just have different patterns and time rates. This is going to work in AGA in a high concentration topical with effective delivery.
Matt you make me want to quit all my work, rob a bank, and then once financially ok, just study biology and genetics full time.
Haha thank you admin. I’m just obsessed with getting this hair back however I can. And all trails were leading to what nasa has been saying in regards to immune system after doing a lot of reading. There would be times I would leave my computer shaking my head smiling and saying underneath my breathe that “this has got to be it”. This happened multiple times. And you continue to make link after link after link and they continue to fit in roughly with your hypothesis. That is what this is driven from. I do say though that I’d love to get involved in the bio sector of chemical engineering after school is done, as opposed to oil, chemicals, etc.
Wow. Thanks MATT.
Would enjoy reading your post in a few days after you have had time to fully digest the articles. Although your last 4-5 sentences pretty much summarize it all. Thanks.
Matt is quite smart… and optimistic on this… good enough for me!
Awesome post admin! I must say, they are rapidly releasing more Jak news of late. Could be a veryyyy good sign indeed. Very hopeful person right here!
so is this another 5 years away again because of trials and red tape?
could we get this ourselves soon, if and when more details come in as to vehicle or delivery?
would details come out or would that be kept hidden for obvious reasons?
Great news…, i can’t beleive that no question addressed to neil at the end was about aga …
Woooooot!!! Just read admins writing in red!!! Holy shit!!
“We will be developing a topical JAK inhibitor for androgenetic alopecia, and the data on that is quite interesting in that they found that the systemic JAK inhibitor does not work for that particular indication, but the topical does, mainly as a function of the target being more superficial in the skin and not really accessible from a systemic circulation.”
Wow, this is a great news !!! I think if we stop using it we will start loosing our hair again but don’t care am willing to use it for the rest of my life if gives me full head of hair
Im ready to smear 10 times a day if it can grow and halt.
FYI — I think I will delay my next post now since this news is so much more important.
Its OK admin, take your time ; ) and we appreciate all this !
Holy crap! After all these years…finally something legit!
Admin what is the timeline for jak aga ?
Seriously though, this really is huge. You can bet your sweet little asses that once they state the percentage of tof/tux they are using topically, it will be trailed PROPERLY by our balding brethren. I know members of PHG tried it, but it was either the wrong vehicle, concentration or both.
Good way to start off our Summer’s I would say.
Admin, good stuff.
Where is nasa_rs when you need him!?
Ofcourse we still need to see exactly how it works, the amount of growth etc. But what a relief that a major company like this puts it out there and tell us straight up that works….
It should reverse the hair to its original state no?
The question I have is…How could they possibly _know_ whether oral vs. topical tofa works or doesn’t work in AGA? They haven’t started trials yet.
Its based on what Dr. Christiano must have told them.
But how could Christiano know?
Either from her past experiments in rats, or perhaps newer experiments in men with MPB that are not yet published in any study..but that she shared with Mr. Walker. Maybe I am hoping for too much?
Admin , I just want to thank you from the bottom of my heart for creating this blog, i visit weekly for updates on latest hairloss research.. i appreciate that u take the time to write these lengthy blog posts..
ADMIN – it actually mirrors that information I gave you (in links). That the Lotion was more Robust than in pill form for the two compounds from 16 years ago. They apparently worked just like JAK.
Yer it should but will it regrow completely areas that has been Bald for years or only reverse miniaturized hairs to their normal state? If its the 1st then we are talking something like a full cure.
Your hairs are always there but they become miniaturized so that you cannot see them in essence bald. Once people take the JAK treatment those miniaturized hairs will become full blown again like when you were 18 years old again.
Sorry bout all the type errors….getting a little too excited bout the good news, haha!
Nobody knows how effective its, we will see.
Admin , I just want to thank you from the bottom of my heart for creating this blog, i visit weekly for updates on latest hairloss research.. i appreciate that u take the time to write these lengthy blog posts..
Is this just theory and speculation based off what Dr. Christiano did on rat studies or do they have physical results proving it works in humans?
The amount of big breakthroughs that amounted to nothing in MPB history could fill a dictionary. Is this another one
This might be the biggest news ever. Why? Because we’ve already seen what it can do to AA sufferes. And thats on AA patients experimenting on their own. Also, this is not some little DIY company who has to use the next 10 yrs gathering funds before the research can start.
Ok, I’ll ease up on the posting now and just read along. Already posted too much today:-)
Spanky – the information is confirmed by two links I gave the Admin ( and I also repeated them on other posts in this topic).
They had two compounds from 16 years ago that supressed some T-Cell and they tried both pill and lotion form. The lotion form worked more robustly and grew hair on AA and on SOME AGA. Now do not get scared that it only worked on SOME since the JAK might be better at surpressing the T-Cell.
Note: i am paraphrasing the technical data since I do not have time to review every word of it.
Sadly they didn’t explicitly state whether they did human trials or if they just assume it will work based on the rodent studies.
But I hope it’s the former…
This is good but..how many time we have to wait for it? Years? is the same thing we always read i think, hope i be wrong
@ spanky – well seeing as many AA sufferers are completely void of hair for a long time and manage to regrow it all, I think there is a good shot of this working for bald scalps. I guess we shall see! :D
@ john jack – as far as I know, they did not systemically dose the mice, only topical. Im sure there was a small, short study seeing as AA sufferers started regrowing hair very rapidly. It wouldn’t have taken long for them to realize if it worked or not for AGA.
Nasa should be Admin Right Hand of this website, i see that you have a scientific opinion like mjones.
mjones come back we want to celebrate.
He is definitely the main man when it comes to JAK. I am the sidekick.
ADMIN – Your Da’ Man.
No way, no how was AGA being solved without your incredible website. You moved thousands out of the dark and into the real world of science where we pushed for a REAL Treatment and GOT IT.
I really think Dr. Walker might have mispoken. I think he is just referring to what is already known from prior statements and research publications by Dr. Christiano. That us, (1) Systemic jak inhibitors definitely DO NOT WORK for AGA. (2) Topical forms ON MICE show greater promise and COULD POTENTIALLY work for AGA because they act closer to the hair follicle.
Obviously, I hope he meant exactly what he said, but I would find that hard to believe because his statement also said they haven’t developed the topical for AGA yet. So what would they have tested to know it works? The AA version? If so, why not just use that for AGA and save the time / expense of additional trials / R&D for a new topical specifically for AGA?
I hope you are wrong, but its a possibility.
Dr Brett King tested this before it was in an “official trial” for AA. And it worked. I believe it is likely that a situation EXACTLY like this has probably happened to AGA. It’s been 2 years since the AA news first broke. I think they have some data, and in humans. Furthermore, we have a guy claiming to have used it at 30% topically (perhaps he mistyped and meant 3% but it could have been 30%) in minoxidil for 4-5 months and had full regrowth. It may be an extremely small sample size but I find it hard to believe they haven’t tried this out yet. And keeping it very much so under wraps. I just know people feel like they’ve been burned so many times in the past that this is just another. But I find it highly unlikely.
I could be wrong, but the wording of the paragraph from walker clearly states he is talking topical vs oral in regards to androgenic alopecia. This doesn’t occur in rodents.
Correct. They cannot test products on AGA anymore on rodents since they can not replicate that condition. Thus it had to have been on a human.
Also if you read the two links I provided else where in this thread. They found a solution for AGA using a topical lotion that surpressed some type of T-cell thing, and apparently that is what JAK’s do. And from 16 years ago they actually had it work on humans but only on SOME. Hopefully the JAK’s will work better as I want all of us to march back into the limelight.
In order to test on humans an investigational drug application has to be made to the FDA after which they can enter phase 1 trials which they can test in humans. before this is approved saftey must be confirmed in the preclinical stage testing on at least two form of animals. i may incorrect but i didnt think they had entered clinical trials for mpb so these results would have been on animal models. However it could be possible that these trials had been overlapped with the AA trial….. Maybe
Just curious, who is this guy? We can say that this is the first example of full hair regrowth that is reported ? This could be clearly a milestone.
Admin, you are not permitted to raise your estimate over 50/50 just based on the laws of jinxes.
Haha after my next post I was actually planning to raise it to 60/40…
It’s 100/0. We have it.
I would tend to agree something close to that. May need DHT lowering via fin too at the same time to get “complete” regrowth. Once you have your hair back you would use as needed (when still DHT sensitive hair becomes thin again).
admin remember tomorrow:
Dr. Gail Naughton to Present Histogen at 6th OneMedForum New York.
June 9th 2016.
Oh great…for once I wish there were no new developments for a few days! Still need to type nasa_rs’s post :-(
EXACTLY WHAT I HAVE BEEN SAYING!!! YIPPEEE!!
Matt – I had presented the ADMIN with two links that I found and he was preparing a post based upon them. One link was a technical abstract that was 16 years old. And it talked about two compounds CsA and FK506 that were tried in both Pill and Lotion. And how it worked for AA but on SOME AGA. In other words it did work on AGA.
Then I tried to identify how those compounds CsA and FK506 were the same or different than JAK. Since I wanted to know if the JAK would work better since I want everyone to have hair and not some. That is when I found a second link that described how some T-receptor (just paraphrasing) was repressed and that seemed to be the common link between those two compounds and JAK. But still I wonder if JAK will work better since it might be more effective at supprerssing (I have no idea just a hope).
Anyways, the Admin and I knew over the past few days while I provided him with the links to the Technical Abstracts that those two old compounds had worked on SOME AGA people. How much hair and the percentage of people I have no Idea. But at least we Knew that it had worked on SOME AGA.
Therefore we went from 1 year ago all the Dr.’s saying JAK would never work to now the old case Identified that proved AGA could be treated and now today’s news. That seems to be a double confirmation and thus highly likely that AGA IS treatable.
One important correction nasa_rs — Two years ago Dr. Brett King said that it was possible JAK inhibitors could treat AGA. Its in an interview of his with Spencer Kobren in one of my old posts. He seems like a really good guy based on what I have read on the alopecia world forums about him from some of his patients.
Cotsarelis dismissed JAKs right away.
Cyclosporin A and FK506 are calcineurin inhibitors. Calcineurin dephosphorylates NFATc1, which then translocates from the nucleus to the cytoplasm. Nuclear NFATc1 maintains quiescence of bulge stem cells, so CsA/FK506 causes those cells to hyperproliferate. Cyclosporin is known to cause hypertrichochis, most likely because of this mechanism, which was also demonstrated in mouse studies.
but did they work similarly to JAK’s?
No. If Jak inhibitors worked similarly to Cyclosporin or FK506, there would be little reason to be intrigued by them. Cyclosporin was ultimately nothing special for AGA. See for example: http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=10&threadid=91167
Read that article. Good stuff in it. This still gives me no reason to doubt the effectiveness of tofacitinib and ruxolitinib, and if a highly selective Jak3/stat3 inhibitor can be developed I think we are well on our way.
Cyclosporin is inhibiting the immune system indeed through inhibiting T-cell response, mainly through Lymphocytes (white blood cells). However, it is doing so through the Jak/Stat/IL-2 family (wiki Ciclosporin). The IL-2 family DOESN’T INVOLVE IL-6, the main interleukin of interest to those losing their hair. The one that has an association with DHT, inflammation, Estrogen, modulating hair cycle length, etc. So the fact that this didn’t work on Androgenic head hair (Or only in a single case report) either topically or orally isn’t a surprise at all to me. The same reasoning goes for the other compound. This mechanism inhibits JAK—->Il-2 family——Il2+Stat gene transcription. In AGA it is Il-6+Stat activated genes.
I should also note that the original Abstract from 16 years ago stated that those two compounds CsA and FK506 were much more robust in lotion form than in pill form. It did not mention which worked for AGA the pill or lotion.
Am I wrong or do we finally have a treatment JAK Lotion for AGA???
It must work. Isn’t a strange coincidence that me and the ADMIN of this site were talking about the exact same thing. That I had the old research that stated AGA had been treated in SOME people THEN we get the news today that it seems JAK works on AGA. It leads me to believe that we are not making a mistake that there is a solution. No surgery, no 10 year wait, just a lotion on the scalp, and hair again.
I’m looking forward to those articles that you presented the admin when that post comes out. Nasa-rs I think you will find the article on mitochondrial stat3 that I posted above highly interesting.
And yes, I do believe that it is finally here. I’m hoping no 10 year wait, but we will see.
Exactly Matt. Here are two links that both must be read and compared to what those two compounds from 16 years ago worked to solve AGA on SOME people and how JAK works.
MATT – can you tell how CsA and FK506 are similar to JAK’s? Remember those two old compounds worked on SOME AGA but not ALL. I wanted to find out if JAK maybe will work better.
I await your comment MATT.
nasa_rs for President!!
I was way ahead of my time. The Admin was by far the genius and hard worker who lead to the successful treatment. His everyday hard work and factual information changed millions of lives forever, all for the better.
I worked hard to spread by belief to other websites too like TBT and I was surprised all they wanted to talk about were HT’s.
Only this Website and this Admin were the only one willing to spread what ultimately is going to be the successful treatment.
Even if it was just hope to one person it was all worth it.
President maybe not. But a dreadlocks statue. Yes
our other options are trump or clinton, so nasa, admin, or matt would be preferable
Give me hair and I’ll be Prez.
Remember how i told you not to hype up jak in your last post?
Well its time to hype up jak.
I never really trusted the 2020 title but with all the new developments around companies and threatments it looks like
were getting closer by the year boys.Cheers
The news is so exciting, felt like shouting out to world that finally there is something on the horizon for baldness. But then again not clear how soon it will be available.
Thanks Admin and Nasa for these kind of news.
I think the ADMIN of this website actually had a big hand in helping to push researchers to this final step. I too, had gone to other websites and laid out logically why JAK would cure AGA.
I think that, and of course others who kept pushing for a solution finally led to the successful result.
What this website did was to get rid of all the old ridiculous and dangerous “solutions” and focused science on a real treatment. And yes the Admin did play a big role since thousands of people who visit this website spread the word to thousands more, and it leads to a huge voice.
Lol thanks nasa_rs, but I also discuss laser, hair transplants, PRP, Dutasteride and much more so I also push other solutions (some of which could be dangerous). But otherwise the blog would be boring and rarely updated.
Take my hat off now to admin and nasa
Excellent work guys
Take a bow for the dd
And continuous hard work
MATT (this is a copy of the post above in case you missed it)
Exactly Matt. Here are two links that both must be read and compared to what those two compounds from 16 years ago worked to solve AGA on SOME people and how JAK works.
MATT – can you tell how CsA and FK506 are similar to JAK’s? Remember those two old compounds worked on SOME AGA but not ALL. I wanted to find out if JAK maybe will work better.
Sorry ADMIN for releasing the data early as now it does not matter and that is Great News.
See my post above nasa… I found your posts :)
Admin, also must say amazing job. You have constitantly kept us up to date on news. This site is by far better than BTT and HLT.
NASA—- you have also “inspired” me to look at the immune angle the past year. You were spot on in my opinion.
Cyclosporine is an immunosuppressant and does come as an opthalmic solution. In its oral dosage form it comes as sandimmune (hardly used now a days) and as neoral (micro emulsion), cyclosporine is a narrow therapeutic index medication (NTI). Tacrolimus (prograf) is also an NTI, comes in 3 different doses for oral administration, and can be formulated as IV, further there is a tacrolinus cream that it used for psoriasis.
Janus kinase inhibitors essentially inhibit interleukins and other cytokines and therefore decrease the immune response.
From now on the topic is, When can we get our hands (heads) on it???
thats what i am wondering :D
Plis someone can answer? its good notice but, we have to wait years for see this on the market? if its the case, we already had good things for the next years like follica histogen sammued etc, then is just one thing more, but the good notice would be that it could be the next year or even this as topic formulation, is my opinion.
How effective will this topical JAK inhibitor could be compared to minoxidil?
It seems promising. People have been saying that the topical may regrow lost hair which is obviously much more effective than minoxidil.
Not even comparable. Minoxidil is a potassium channel agonist and a weak Ar competitor with DHT. It is ancient history. A relic of old science in my opinion. Fin is much better, and even that should pale in comparison to a JAK/stat inhibitor alone. JAK inhibitor will hit far more pathways.
Yes but is it wise to go on minoxidil now if I am already on fin? (diffuse thinner)
hey nasa and admin, one question:
why JAK is better than minoxidil for example??? why all world talking about a “cure” ????
FULL HEADS OF F’ing HAIR SOON!!
sets, go the “Categories” menu on this blog (left side if viewing on a desktop/laptop) and select “JAK inhibitors” in there. Then go through all those posts, especially the ones with images and videos.
Now imagine that working on MPB/AGA!
Admin what is your prediction on Jak Inhibitors? Do you believe in them? I also have a great relationship with my immunology professor and I am ready to tell them about this!
Where is MrJones??? The guy is going to go in shock when he reads this thread. I hope he suddenly did not quite this blog.
Lol dont worry he is quietly reading… admin you must add last seen like in whatsapp…you will see him the first…just kidding
this development made my day!! woohooo thanks admin and nasa
I’ve been a lurker on this blog for a few years now, and told myself I would only comment when a cure/new effective treatment was on the horizon.
I don’t want to get ahead of myself, but reading the developments on JAK this year and the back and forth between Matt, Nasa, and the Admin, I think the day has finally come.
Cheers to a potential huge step in human scientific history, and thank you for all of your work Admin.
Spending a large portion of 20 million dollars for development of jak inhibitors to treat mpb would be quite a ridiculous gamble if the company had no indication that it would work… now, add this logic to the statement above regarding topicals plus everything we’ve seen about jak inhibitors’ effects on mice and dp cells that are unrelated to autoimmune, and things are looking good here
This. And the fact that aclaris aquired 2 JAK inhibitor startup companies before Angela’s groundbreaking topical paper. They know guys. They raised 20 million very fast indeed. Always say to follow the money. Angela had to be silent in order to protect her IP. If she shouted this out only the pharma companies making Tofacitinib and Ruxolitinb, as well as topical compounding pharmacies, would profit. If you won mega millions or powerball you wouldn’t go screaming down the street you won the lottery. You’d risk getting mugged and having your ticket taken. You’d celebrate in your house and then call a lawyer and protect the winning ticket/your identity until you were safe to cash in. Same concept goes for JAK/stat inhibition and AGA. In my opnion, she’s known for a while this works in AGA too. Also, why would spencer kobren randomly post the interview on the top of his forum as apposed to all the other technologies/ AGA news and breakthroughs? Perhaps she told him something off air to get his attention? Also, if you go back and listened to the interview at one point she nearly made a slip up saying it worked for AGA if I remember right, and then caught herself and said AA. Was this a Freudian slip? Hate to be a conspiracy theorist but hey, this kinda stuff does happen.
Well said Matt!
Long time lurker, and This sounds like it could be it. I hope so at least. Maybe my days of shaving my head might be ending. Thank you admin, and the other commenters on this board!
My theory too was the reason why Beno worked on the two sun worshipers is that when they had a severe sunburn (one fell asleep in the sun) that the circulation entered the skin allowing Beno to get in there. That is why they grew hair.
Same thing with the Campfire guy. Old man fell into fire head first and regrew his hair. He was probably on the right Arthritis drug (and who would know that) and again the drug was able to get into the skin.
I am telling you the puzzle is all coming together now. This has to be it.
Don’t want to get greedy and talk investment opportunities.. but we’re all ahead of the curve on this.. I’ll be watching the ticker closely..
More importantly, this could help us all in life in general… me especially after years of covering ht surgery gone wrong
Fingers crossed that the news stays positive!
thank you nasa and admin!
we will hope news soon about JAK. Maybe a real cure is around the corner. I think is question of time and the correct dosage for success.
But is the treatment for life? you will need put a lotion every day in your scalp? A lot of questions!
MATT – might now the answer to how often to use it.
My guess, and it is only an uneducated guess. Is it took years to lose hair once the bad affects built up to shrink the hair follicle. One the hair follicle becomes cleaned of the bad affects more than likely they will take months to build up again. My guess again, is initially you might use it twice a day for 3-6 months and after than probably once a week.
perfect but hdt don´t will attack again the follicle?
This is my fear as well. Why I also suggested using fin as well in conjunction with topical JAK/stat to really kick start the process off. So jak/stat inhibitor would need to be taken often. It won’t change your androgen receptor gene so after stopping JAK/stat inhibition I would venture to guess miniaturization would start happening again (faster? Slower? Same?)
Fin might not be strong enough. Look at how dut outperforms fin — this indicates that androgen sensitivity increases with the progression of AGA. This could be due to a combination of AR upregulation, increased number of co-activators (both of which occur in AGA) or even androgen-independent activation of AR (which no one has really looked for). It could also be that due to damage of cell organelles such as mitochondria, the cells have a lower stress tolerance and therefore a higher androgen sensitivity. Or both.
Another thought: For those of you who have access to JAK inhibitors right now, how about doing a patch test? The concentration that works miracles for AA doesn’t do so for AGA, so some have suggested that a higher concentration is necessary to see results in AGA. Therefore, it would be interesting if someone could try a high concentration on a small patch of bald scalp.
I would have no idea how long/often to use it. I think it would depend on an individual’s hair cycle length and ability to get rid of inflammation. But in high enough concentration and taken for long enough I don’t see why this could work for nearly everybody.
This will be great if it actually grows back legit hair unlike Min. Even if it does, it would take a while to set in cuz that would be huge, so used to accepting that nothing will help with MPB it would blow my mind if this happens.
If the Formula gets out (is known) I would think people will be able to get it in other countries as soon as the Formula is known. Remember the main drug is already FDA approved and thus already in the market it just needs to be mixed correctly with whatever compound makes it work.
Well i would like to say thank you , to the admin and nasa , for the great reporting on this topic . I will remain cautiously optimistic on this topic as i would like to hear more from some sort of a human trial of these drugs . I believe it will take a few years at least to get this to market , but that is nothing if it is a cure . Does anyone know when we will potentially hear more news from the company , or when some sort of trial with humans will start ?
Now we are talking about having a solution shortly. How would one go about getting these drugs? And, in order to get a 30 percent solution, you would probably need quite a lot of drugs. How much is this going to cost you, assuming you can get a prescription and make your own vehicle?
People dont get so emocional exited to much. Any Light of hope is Good but if you search something the jak will be first aoroved for alopecia areata. And is now Know data for this. I think the reserch for AA is 3 or 4 years in front of AGA. So will se. And if you reserch in alopecia world (something that some over hype commenters here forgot to reserch) the jak drog not work for all AA. This is real people like us already taking this drogs. And 1 year of this drog is like 80.000$. Lets see and dont get over the top in your emotion. Because you Know the feeling of deception….. For me i will happy if the drog work in the same rate of AA. Like 50/50
The guys on TBT and HLT are trying to keep their composure and act cool like this news is meh, but i’m sure deep down their hearts are racing like a mofo.
Like the rest of us. :] but some crazys need to believe it thinking that will get the drog out more Quick. XD
When the topical is out for AA, many of us should be able to get an off-label prescription.
Waiting – Never thought of that, great idea.
Hey. I guess I’m joining the party late.
First things first… SPAM yes. Secondly… I was data SPAM. Real data, not some dude saying he thinks it is going to work. And then I want photos, mainly to watch you all argue about them.
But really, here are my questions and thoughts.
How far along is the process for jak for AA? I haven’t been following, sorry. Obviously the sooner that the topical for AA comes out the sooner we will find out for ourselves if it really works.
My second worry is this: have you seen the costs for jak inhibitors? It is down right crazy. Obviously if they are making it in abundance it will get cheaper but right now it is something like $2000/ month. Too expensive for me.
Lastly – I’m truly interested in the side effects. I remember reading that jaks can be pretty harsh.
One final thought. I just saw an Instagram account the other day of a woman taking jaks orally for AA. She lowered her dose and lost ground almost immediately (a couple of months) and said that that she was starting from square one again. My guess is if this works it will be a daily medicine thing but hopefully they can make it into a nice shampoo or something that we can mix in with hair products (if it is anything like applying minoxidil I might just shoot myself – joking – god that shit was annoying when I tried it out)
Thanks to nasa. Great find man… I feel like this community is crazy good at researching (some of us anyway) – it’s like the horticulture community seeing benefits from crazy pot heads that sit and study the best way to raise their plants.
Why would they make such a big claim without any proof to back it up. It would make sense if they are needing additional funding to proceed with their project but it doesn’t seem like that either.
If the claim is based on what Christiano had told them, then there certainly would be pictures or some sort of scientific evidence.
Just my two cents.
Ive had 2 theories about this since christanos interview with kobren earlier this year…
1. christano knew it worked, formed vixen pharm, then sold her IP to the highest bidder, all without ever showing her hand.
2. She knew didnt really work, but made hints that it would just to raise the buying price of her IP
I really hope theory 1 is correct. Both of these theories would explain why they never did a test case (like they did w AA or vitiligo) featuring someone with aga. Cant show your hand till youve gotten paid
Perhaps they HAVE done a test case like they did in AA and are keeping it under wraps. The demand for this product would far exceed the supply had they had an article showing a man with AGA, as apposed to AA, regrow a full head of hair with pictures.
Hairless cured. Goodnight.
Cure or treatment? :D
The molecular weight for Xeljanz (Tofacitinib-Citrate) is 504 dalton, too big to pass through the skin, which would explain why it cannot be used topically.
For topical use for AGA it will have to be a different formulation (Tofacitinib-Something else) or another JAK inhibitor entirely.
This is because of the citrate group attached. Used to prevent degradation. Pure Tofacitinib is under 500 Daltons.
True Matt. I saw that when I was searching:
312 to be exact. So they will either have to bind it to something smaller or use another JAK inhibitor.
What do you think is more likely, that they would use one of the new generation selective JAK inhibitors that they mentioned in the webcast? Or just reformulate Tofacitinib to be a better topical?
I think ideally they’d develop something really effective for JAK3/STAT3 inhibition as apposed to targeting all of the Jak/stat pathway like tofac/ruxol do. They do have a “hierarchy” of what they selectively inhibit though.
I hope for our sake they can at least just release topical tofacitinib for this in the meantime (as in shorter amount of years) while they are developing something more selective for the AGA condition.
Berberine is a selective JAK3 inhibitor. It’s commonly available as a dietary supplement. I’d love to hear your thoughts.
hey i am confused is this declare based on scientific results ?
As a longtime lurker also, and having followed the developments surrounding JAK inhibitors closely via this site, I feel hugely buoyed up by these latest indicators of the treatments likely efficacy.
Thanks to Admin and nasa_rs for covering the news.
Something upthread that nasa_rs says about miniaturised hair regrowing as it would have been at age 18 prompts me to ask a question here. Do you think, assuming the JAK lotion indeed fulfills its promise, the hair would regrow without being grey? Or am I being greedy now lol!
I dont think Aclaris is going to use either tof or Rux as they belong to other companies…. they might be making their own JAK’s …thats why Aclaris bought JAK Pharm and key organics …thats why they must be still in testing phase…
Please let this be the company that gets a solid new product on the streets fast and effective!!
It doesn’t state that this has been tested on humans, so the rhetorical question is how would the Dr know? I’d wager it’s just theorising on his part, based on that famous extrapolation on the “mouse model”.
As the saying goes: believe it when you see it!
someone knows the timeline?
when does the trials starts?
when do you think it will be available on market?
i must say its great news, but if its going to take years so **** that ****. i want my hair now, still in my 20s and not in my 30s.
no photos, no dates. i think it makes me the only not optimistic erader here.
Well if they say it works on mbp you’d have to assume thats because they actually tried it. But yes, some sort of evidence is what we need to get complete clarification. Imo this already seems much more reliable than any of the mpb news ive heard in a long long time.
Definitely an exciting development and I really do hope it comes to fruition, but I think there are also some realities we have to face up to, being the potential side effects and the prohibitive cost, as already stated.
It will be interesting to see how soon this can be brought to market if they do proceed with it…I’d assume the safety trials are taken care of given they have released it for AA usage? Though for those of us in europe, i’d expect a lonnnnng wait.
Brilliant news, from reading the comments, I think it’s key to realise that they still do not have a product yet. If they had, I’m sure they would of announced it there and the . As others have stated, it looks like they’re going to have to create a new formula, which would mean new trials. From my own point of view, I’m still hoping that Replicel come out on top. The science behind it makes sense to me, I just hope they can perfect it. On that note, does anyone have any info on where Replicel are upto? It’s been a while….
I just dont know what this hype XD we have to wait years again for see this launched and still dont know for sure if this work, as always is just my opinion but i have heard “we are cured” and just want to say, take care, is just another thing which be launched after few years.
I bet also the very painful itch at our balding sites will be over as soon as this topical JAK is available. After the balding itself, this itch is the second aspect that is driving people crazy who experience this. Especially if you know that this pain comes first, and then you lose hair fast at that spot.
No inflammation = no immune attack = no itch / pain = no hair loss
If the king of hair loss said this won’t work for aga then it won’t work, sorry :/
Who said that?
I think he’s talking about Cotsarelis.
King of hair loss? Lol. What’s his claim to fame? Setipiprant? It hardly even works, show me one person who is maintaining on it. The PGD2 angle hasn’t shown any results in practice yet.
He’s going to get beat to the finish line by a long shot, probably.
He had a vested interest to say it won’t work. He still had the rights to pgd2 tech and Follica at the time that came out 2014.
This is an obligation to those who invested in him and shareholders. He was obviously going to downplay it. And at first, it was used orally which definitely can have side effects. We now know this has been used as a topical and worked equally effectively (for AA) . Swoop, who I think is severely misinformed and just refuses to believe anything other than Ar theory, said on HLT they haven’t tried it as a topical.
Yes they have. It isn’t just orally used.
I believe in Jak inhibitors. I was always convinced that inflammation plays a big role in hair loss. At least that’s what I’ve personally experienced. Let’s hope for the best, expect the worst.
One thing we all agree upon, the admin is putting a lot of efforts into this. Highly appreciate it mate – although I am not a regular commenter but your blog is the first thing I check every morning.
How was your personal experience with inflammation ?? can you explain more ?
I had a spinal cord injury in June 2012! A lot of symptoms originated from this problem. One of the symptoms I experienced afterwards was hair shedding. All the neurologists I went to suggested that I had chronic inflammation in my neck and nervous system due to the injury.
When my hair shedding continued I consulted few dermatologists. They all confirmed it was MPB, unfortunately the DHT theory makes them rule out any other factors. I accepted the fact that I had MPB but knew that my neck injury triggered the whole shedding/thinning process.
After 4 years of dealing with the problem I noticed that when my neck is better (due to osteopathy), the whole shedding process stops. When it starts bugging me again mainly due to inflammation the hair shedding restarts aggressively. It has happened many times already so I know what I’m talking about :). Even my osteopath and another chiropractor said they’ve experienced similar situations with other patients.
@Hallucinate, I too have a spinal injury where my C3-C5 is pushing against my spinal cord. I don’t feel much pain, just some discomfort and weakness in my upper left arm. My hairloss started the same time as the injury, so I agree with your observation.
I also want to add, my Ferritin level way over normal. I don’t remember the numbers but it was high. From what i remember high Ferritin is an indication of inflammation.
Not related to hair loss, but I herniated my disc between L5/S1 a little over 4 years ago. Worst pain of my life. Took about 10 months for the sciatica down the outer part of my right leg to finally go away.
Admin have you ever stated where you think the cure will eventuate from?
Swoop….Stop talking broscience…You work for Kirkland (Minoxidil) you don’t want Jak inhibitors in the market. That’s all.
Before that he was accused of being a Kane shill
What’s next man?
BIG QUESTION I WOULD LIKE A LOGICAL ANSWER…..
IF and its a big if, all this information is true a d they really have found a cure…
Why is this not in the mainstream news? Why when you type in anything even remotely related to this, does nothing come up??
If this is BIG news..then you would think it would be in the NEWS…
It will be soon if some more positive news leaks.. this blog is way ahead of the mainstream.. which is why you’re here reading it
Comercial interests….that’s all.
This Dr. Neil Walker is a Doctor in osteopathy… doesn’t fill me with confidence that he didn’t just convey his words wrong.
Jaks might not work, follica might not work, riken/tsuji might not work. Brotzu definitely won’t work. goddamn
might….might….might…always might. Goodbye Opinion.
Might = Yes it works…. For some xD
Brotzu will work.
Osteopaths are the most knowledgable when it comes to human structure… they are also so faimilar with inflammatory diseases. Just saying! and ur name should be Mr. Mighty instead of Opinion :)
Also, let’s do an English sentence breakdown haha
“We will be developing a topical JAK inhibitor for androgenetic alopecia, and the data on that is quite interesting in that they found that the systemic JAK inhibitor does not work for that particular indication, but the topical does, mainly as a function of the target being more superficial in the skin and not really accessible from a systemic circulation”
From the first word until the first “that” —-
The first “that” could refer to JAK inhibitor data in general or as it applies to androgenic alopecia
“The systemic JAK inhibitor does not work for that particular indication but the topical does”
This now clearly ties the words “that indication” to ANDROGENIC ALOPECIA
So unless he mispoke he is pretty clear on what he means in the preceding paragraph. I truly do think they have some highly guarded pre data showing this works in AGA as well
Matt that breakdown was impressive! Especially the ROS part which I wasn’t aware of. Lots of pieces coming together wow. I’ve also been researching everything AGA (I’m 22 studying physics) but not as systematically as you apparently. You should definitely consider entering the bio sector of chem eng I think you’ll find it fascinating. One more thing, it seems that the compounds disregulated by AGA are (obviously) needed to some extent for the prevention of cancer, infection etc. so I guess we’ll need a specific dosage if the drug works right? Too large a dose could lead to potentially dangerous side effects, at least in the scalp since it probably doesn’t go systemic easily.
I definitely agree regarding cancer. The JAK/stat pathway is a powerful immune regulator and has a lot of different stimulators “environmentally”. In some bodily systems high JAK/stat signaling is a “go” signal… Aka cancer when too high. In others like muscles and hair follicle, it is a stop signal. One thing I’ve noticed, and this isn’t from a particular ariticle or anything, is that is seems that this pathway is used as a “stop” signal in tissues that have very high turnover. Muscle is constantly being used (or you atrophy quickly) and hair is also very fast growing. It would only make sense that a depletion of energy would cause cause this process to come to a grinding halt gradually (going bald) just like muscle wasting happens gradually with age. If you also look at it, muscle is one of the only tissues which can greatly increase in size over a short period of time. This matches the high growth rate of hair shaft itself, and matches the use of the JAK stat pathway.
you are brave man majoring in physics haha. I am very glad engineering physics 1 and 2 are over. Did well but was much less enjoyable than the other classes I’ve been in so far
Are you saying the jak/stat pathway is used in the muscles or did you use them as an example for your point? The only compound I’m aware of that inhibits muscle growth is myostatin. And any muscle atrophy that comes with age probably comes from lower test levels. Old roiders have no problem with muscle atrophy. Then again it may be just a counter effect. They do look a bit flatter with age tho – maybe less glycogen or intramuscular fat? I’m rambling tho… thanks for the info on aga I’d say let’s keep our fingers crossed but since we spend time on google researching aga like proper nutjobs instead of hitting on chicks or sth I suppose sitting with our fingers crossed isn’t our thing. As for physics, it’s fun but chem eng must be pretty cool too. My best bro is majoring in it. You guys must have a buttload of assignments
Here is the article that explains stat3 and muscle regeneration. Lowering JAK/stat signaling helps in regeneration. This explains maybe the critical favors in why the elderly cannot repair muscles as well.
Yes we do have a lot of work in ChemE, but it’s what I signed up for! Knew what I was getting into .
Thank you for pointing that out…. I just found a piece of gold!
In the article there are 5 groups:
2 of which received testosterone, and the other three which recieved much more powerful androgens (anabolic steroids)
Up through day 5, all 5 groups showed immune suppression…. Aka I’m sure JAK/stat signaling was largely suppressed.
However, by day 10 the three groups that had recieved more powerful androgens had an immunostimulatory effect. It activated the immune system. This fits in with the hypothesis that those deficient in 5-ar enzyme do not lose their head hair and don’t develop body hair. THE BODY CANT MAKE THE MORE POWERFUL ANDROGEN DHT FROM TESTOSTERONE WHICH ACTIVATES THE IMMUNE SYSTEM AKA TOO MUCH STAT3 LOCALLY. ALSO EXPLAINS WHY THOSE WHO ARE CASTRATED DONT LOSE HAIR AT ALL, OR THE HAIR LOSS STOPS DEAD IN ITS TRACKS. It clearly requires a certain threshold of immune activation. In Europeans with a certain nasty Ar variant, this immune response is getting rapidly activated. For some as early as puberty. Body can’t metabolise DHT locally and the the immune cascade begins. For the record, and this can be looked up, stat3 is also present in smooth muscle tissue, not just skeletal. Smooth is what the errector pili muscle is. This loses contact with hair eventually in AGA. But I think it can be recaptured. Why? Because in FUE hair transplants the arector pili is cut and the hairs transplanted back into the balding scalp area. Well what happens? It reforms another erector pili muscle over time (along with revascularization) as long as it has the right signals ( and we know it does bc the hair never miniaturizes from the good donor area).
This also shows why in the other article I posted, regardless of high or low androgen, elderly (who have low) were able to greatly regenerate muscle under local immunosupression (JAK/stat inhibition).
Hope you’ll see this – not sure how well replies work on this site (only thing that could perhaps use some improvement). btw that steroid study… I noticed all 3 steroids do not aromatize (testolactone even reverses aromatization) while the opposite is true for test. This is as far as I can go but maybe you can draw a conclusion from this? Also, I didn’t know the ar pili muscle gets reconnected, tho it was obvious transplanted follicles can cycle normally even after separation from the muscle
Actually, if I remember right I believe that after FUE transplantation the hair initially falls out and then takes months to start growing again. I’d have to say this period is probably when the follicular units and regenerating their erector pili muscles and revascularizing.
Great point also in regards to aromatizing. That makes sense as to the difference in the two groups ability to bind with Ar being different
I’m thinking of either a Flock of Seagulls haircut or a Judge Napolitano.
He said they have tested it for aga and it works , he clearly wasn’t referring to a mice
you are right HLSCC. And of course, they have new results and new data from Jak inhibitors for MPB.
@Opinion, he said it works ofcourse he can always come back and say ohhh it didnt work as good as he thought. But, credibility means also to a company like this. Imagine going out getting new investors after making a public statement that was a lie.
Yes! Good point!
Hope today he will be asked more about aga in the conference …
I trust cots a lot as he has been working in this field for years now. He is making a strong and high quality treatment that can grow 100 hair every cm2 and he is going to use more than 1 product to make a super effective treatment.
I think the 100 hairs per cm2 is just marketing from Pure Tech. Cots has never given a figure.
@Opinion. Nobody is obliged to give information…It’s easy. Don’t underestimate Dr. Cotsarelis.
How do you know Cots is planning to use a combination of products? It might just be minox, followed by an “upgrade” 10 years down the line.
Please go and look at puretch website and look at follica pipeline. There are 3 bars in the pipeline and according to puretech the 4th bar is going to be added in 2017
Mjones said something that makes me wonder. Follica + Jak
No jak won’t be used
Ya they would definitely not use a JAK/stat inhibitor after wounding. You need the immune pathway to get the stem cells to move in and close the wound.
@Khourii those bars represent studies/product candidates? What does it tell us about drug protocol? Don’t get it.
That what I think, each bar means a product.
he said clearly “works in aga with topical” if works like in AA we will have a full cure
Its nice to see that a leader of a big company thats working on aa issues saying that jak can provide “interesting” results on Aga.
If theres something that I learned from all these years is that all those liars who promess a cure with false products that are scams always love to use exaggerated words and slogans like “completr cure”, “the end of baldness is rught here, buy xxx”.
Meanwhile, very serious and knowledgable people always choose to use moderate words like “interesting”, and I have the feeling that this word actually means something great is comming!
I dont how can anyone not being very excieted by this news. Yeah, thats a big news!
Remember people, we went from “but does jak work for aga ? It works for aa, its complete different, it might not work for aga” to “it WORKS fo aga”. How is this not big news ?
The next question now is: Do jak inhibitors work for aga as good as they do for aa ?
If the answer is year, for many that could be considered a cure!
^that is the question… it’s going to take trials. If it does work well, it will still need to go through the typical fda clinical trials which would mean years out before receiving an approval from the FDA.
But really if it does work well, it is just a matter of putting a timer on and waiting for the product to come out. The whole timeline thing (5 years etc.) never made. People would say “we are 5 to 10 years out from a treatment… really that is only reasonable once a treatment/ cure has been found to work. Then it needs to go through the FDA pipeline (5 to 10 years).
Yeah, we need to give it a time and follow the trials.
Now its already known that jak works for aga and that they will have trials. Remember that part of the 20milliom dollars were raised to be invested on jak inhibitors in androgentic alopecia wich incoudes mpb. We will have trials soon, thats 100% confirmed.
But how long it will take to pass througb all the trial phases, being FDA approved and to be conmercialized, thats very speculative.
Some might say that it would take 5 years or more, but remember that jak inhibitors are already approved drugs:
For me, as long as it works for mpb similar as they do to aa, its already fantastic news even if i will take a few years to be avaliable on the market.
But remember, theres that thing called black market. Thats a good alternative to get it, who knows, sooner than we could imagine.
So not all medicines (or Jak inhibitors) are going to be treated as “the same”. If it is truly a different drug it will most likely have to go through full clinical trials.
The only thing I think that might really benefit/ speed up the process is if the IND study they did for AA uses the same topical drug that would be used for AGA. That would mean that phase 1 would most likely be completed with that study as it would show safety and maybe nothing but an IND study would be needed to jump start it to Phase 2 trials so that they can start proving efficacy.
I have very limited knowledge of the clinical trial process though, so take all of that with a grain of salt.
On the really big plus side. IF and it is a big if… they prove that it works, the company would undeniably put it on a fast track path within the company as the potential profit margins would be huge.
I’m waiting to see a couple of things and then I might invest in Aclaris. Their stock is going to sky rocket if JAKs are really the solution.
Para conseguirmos esse produto aqui no Brasil por um preço justo, só através de contrabando mesmo, haha ! Imagina um medicamento que já custa 2000 dólares + a taxa de importação, iremos ter cabelo mas iremos morrer pobres, seria trocar uma miséria por outra :P
My bad, this response was meant to GuyFromBrazil, my fellow compatriot.
it is really quite surprising that no one made a comment on.. what if they are BS-ing us and only intention of theirs is to increase their stock price?
@Hallucinate, I responded to your post above regarding spinal cord injury and inflammation. I injured my spinal cord as well. Although my injury is not serious but I believe it does affect hairloss. How’s your Ferritin level? Mine is through the roof. From what i read, Ferritin is an indication of inflammation and high levels of Ferritin will cause hairloss.
Also a daily reader who doesn’t comment much but immensely appreciates this website. This could be terrific news. I was looking at my hair in an elevator today and thought to myself I hope they find a cure soon. I had a transplant with Dr Rahal 7 years ago and got great results but it’s thinning out substantially now.
Please let this be the one.
Thanks Admin, you’re doing something really wonderful. And to the positive commentators too. Cheers.
How many time it would take to be launched?
Something not related to post, but please request to read once!
This was very sad to read. It shows the psychological impact hairloss can have, leading to the decision making process being compromised in a desperate bid to fix the problem. I think there is a market for hair transplants but once again highlights the importance of doing thorough research into reputable surgeons. I also think the reputable surgeons are unintentionally contributing to the rise of these unqualified surgeries by charging so much leading to those less well off seeking cheaper alternatives. The only affordable options are 2,3 doctors in Turkey and India who have iahrs recommendation.
I know they cant just release something with a new label just cuz its already approved for something else but I hope to god that its not gonna take 5+ years.
I think there are good signs that say jak can really be something else, a gamechanger for mpb treatments.
Someone has posted here that a famous guy known as “the hairloss king” said that jak would t work.
Some people like to make this guy the definitive authority of any hairloss related topic, as if he was a god. No matter how much knowledgable he is, that doesnt make him the most trustful guy on earth and and his word the truth. People forget that the best non clinical treatment we have (fin) till these days was discovered by accident by people who never made any serious research and study about hairloss before.
Anther thing to consider is that neither this so called “king of hairloss) nor the HT guys made any public comments on, lets say, histogen product. Why ? Histogen doesnt represent a threat to them, simple. All these guys want to make people believ that their trestment is the best alternative to consumers, and obviously any potential huge treatment in the future that can be a much better alternative to people wouldnt be welcomed by these guys. Their attempt to downplay the effectiveness of jak inhibitors must actually be understood as a very positive sign. I have no doubt that jak is indeed a threat to the HT industry and many other who want to bring other treatment alternatives.
It’s great news, it’s not a full cure “results seem interesting” but definitely wayyy better than the currents shitty approved ones, hope the timeline isn’t long ….
My feeling that AA is an auto-immune disease with the same outlying problems but caused by the immune system actually attacking the follicles, which is more aggressive and harder to treat.
My feeling with AGA is that the same base things are wrong, but they’re progressive as we age. The follicles shed, miniaturise and then fall dormant.
I may not be explaining it clearly, but perhaps they have alot of common and AA/AGA have more symptoms in common. Perhaps the JAK inhibitors could work even better for AGA than they do in AA, i.e instead when you stop using the topical the hair follicles will continue into a normal hair cycle.
I’m just ball parking here guys. Also, just to add some hype… we saw the photos of the amazing woman who is documenting her hair loss experience on Instagram. Her results were absolutely incredible, bald to a head full of her natural hair. That’s the best of the best in terms of regrowth, no doubt. What remains to be seen is a way for her to keep her hair and the same question could apply to us… perhaps it could be a topical that you have to apply everyday, but perhaps the best possible result for us could be we apply it untill our hair cycles again naturally.
Also, one really awesome thing i noticed.. her hairline was completely restored…
She is smooth bald, just like us.. except the trigger is completely different. Throw one more positive on top, this is a TOPICAL and less systematic than the oral tablet.
So aslong as it seeps into the hair follicles it should work and regulate our hair growth. Told you guys, keep the faith there are people working on delivering better treatments and eventually a cure.
Whats her IG?
Its all great @Breezy but we have all been waiting for so long. Now that we have something in the horizon that might actually be incedible we wanna atleast have some sort of idea as to when we can be treated. Years pass by and none of us are getting any younger…atleast not until we also have a cure for agning;)
Guys don’t get too excited yet, we still don’t know if this works for us
@khourii: Seems that they have evidence that it works for people with MPB. Watch/Listen the presentation again please.
JUNE 8, 2016 AT 2:14 PM
They said in the presentation that topical JAK inhibitors work for AGA.
Awesome news and great blog.
Check this out plz ! on trials they didn’t get the regrowth that was celebrated with christiano’s case BUT THE IMPORTANT PART IS THAT 2 years after stopping trials and talking thoses jaks their hair continued to grow to reach full regrowth !
Can anyone with scientific background explain plz? @matt
I think because this is IL-2 subfamily target it wouldn’t be really effective for AGA. This is a T-cell and immune response. AGA has the IL-6 associated family much more involved. Perhaps the IL-2 response is much more rapid and exerts its effects dramatically compared to the “slower acting” IL-6 effects. But this once again ties cytokines to hair growth in general.
Funny that I was just reading that muscle paper.
“The reduced regenerative potential observed in aging skeletal muscle is attributed primarily to changes in the muscle niche. Soluble ligands from the Notch, Wnt and transforming growth factor-beta (TGF-beta) signaling pathways are deregulated both systemically and within the satellite cell niche. Alterations in the activity of these pathways in combination with fibrosis and an increased immune response result in age-related deficiencies in satellite cell self-renewal and regenerative efficacy. Notably, a recent publication described intrinsic changes in geriatric satellite cells involving de-repression of p16 (also called Ink4a and Cdkn2a) in mice over 28 months of age. Other recent studies have implicated the p38-alpha and p38-beta mitogen-activated kinase pathway in the age-related intrinsic changes that occur in aged satellite cells from mice. Moreover, differences in satellite cell number and proliferative capacity have been noted in mouse and rat satellite cells isolated from the skeletal muscle of 3-month-old compared to 7-month-old rodents. Taken together, these findings indicate that age-related changes in satellite cell self-renewal, proliferative and differentiation capacity are likely due to both extrinsic alterations in the microenvironment and intrinsic alterations in cell-autonomous regulatory mechanisms.”
All of these things have been observed in AGA except the immune response and p38 MAPK as far as I know. However, p38 MAPK is likely involved in AGA as well — it’s a typical oxidative stress-activated pathway and increased phosphorylation of HSP27, a downstream target of p38, has been observed in AGA DPCs. So who knows? Maybe JAK inhibitors can do some work for AGA. However, I think androgen hypersensitivity might be another barrier…Perhaps JAK-STAT inhibitors and AR knockdown would be a sweet combo. And nuking senescent cells. Those three things might be a nice combo lol.
Good explanation. I’ve also noticed many of those pathways being involved in AGA as well. If you do some google research you will find they all involve stat3 in one way or another. It seems the immune system regulates many of the other systems like a “teeter-totter”. It regulates thresholds and turns off and on many genes.
And I have also suggested exactly what you put at the end. It would be much more effective in my opinion to take fin while taking a topical jak/stat inhibitor. Once the hair is cycling again you would just stay on jak/stat inhibitor in my opinion. I also read somewhere some months ago an association between cellular senescence and immune system. So perhaps just by lowering immune response you could get those cells healthy and “redividing” again.
yesterday “nasa” was in big hype!
whats up today?
I only read pesimistic posts !
This is normal once the initial “Omg the cure is finally here!!1!1” hype dies down and everyone thinks things through a bit more rationally. A few more critical posts turn up, people read it through and then get a bit disillusioned, until the next hype train. Either way, it’s just a useless emotional roller-coaster until things start hitting the market, or the black market. Though every once in a while, even false hope is better than none…
Sounds promising although as it is in pre-clinical stages still at the minimum of 5 years away. Is there results from the alopecia areata where a patient was suffering from mpb aswell as AA? this would thus give an indication of whether the treatment is truly effective mpb?
ps this blog is very insightful keep up the awesome job
If you come back, please post with another username as there is already a matt who has posted many useful comments recently!
For now I added a “2016” to the end of your name.
Matt2016.. not true, since the quote says AGA is not effected by oral medication, while we know that oral meds are effective for AA type hair loss only.
The good news, however, is that apparently the topicals do work for AGA. We’ll have to wait to see results as they test and improve topicals.
Hey guys about JAK , the illuminati says your welcome.
Jk it’s egghead. Cheers to a happy 2017 or 18 whenever aclaris decides to go to market
Funny egghead, but please do not use his name again as he is one of a kind:-)
Hahaha I agree
Sorry about that
Nice to see you here MJones. I think you missed the big news yesterday and I was not sure if you were coming back.
All the different point of views from the Core members and now we pretty much agree that we have our solution. I do not care what it is just get things Growing again.
Now the topic is Where and When can we get it???
I would think Foreign Pharmacies might have it first. But I have to get my hands on it ASAP.
Did you see the photos of that girl? Incredible how all of her hair grew back, perfect. Just think 2 years ago that was impossible. Now it is AGA turn. I want the solution form Where Ever and ASAP. I know it will be at least 1 year.
nasa_rs, it is not mjones…its “egghead” as he says in the comment (“jk” means just kidding).
Egghead please do not do it again as you are confusing people.
Sw00p has laid out the case for why jaks won’t work for aga…
We got nothing on the horizon.
Tsuji: conceptual and decades away
Brotzu: snake oil
“Hair Site” seems more realist about the situation and future expectations from the hair industry
Do you honestly think he knows more than all these scientists putting big money behind the thing?
He’s speculating based on information available to him. He’s knowledgeable, but doesn’t mean he knows everything, or that he’s automatically right.
I’m not telling you to be a hopeless optimist, but rather patiently wait and see. It’s very easy to discard things on first sight.
He doesn’t know more than them. Nor do I or anyone else. There is a reason this has so much hype. And a reason it is going to be tried in AGA as well, after posting insane results in AA (pics are incredible in those who work). And the science from this has come from someone who researches the genetics behind different hair loss disorders. You all do the math.
Excellent point that I was thinking of making in my next post. There are some super smart people on here and on the forums, but why on earth would anyone want to believe them over the world leading researchers!?
Who the hell is sw00p?
I’d bet he’s a famous member of a hairloss related forum out there who work on HT cirgury.
Hes a regular at HLT forum
My suggestion is do not wait for THE CURE, just go futher with your life. Then after a few years there will be suddenly on the eight o clock breaking hair worldnews, the cure is there! So do get a life, and forget all these hair shit!
I’m sure we could all do that if hair loss didn’t affect our life in the meantime.
News is on at 6pm son. Also cool, stop checking this site Dr Phil.
All my respect to Swoop Whose knowledge in this matter is out of doubt and he is extremely useful to our community. . But I think that if aclaris decided to invest many millions on jak they must have faith in them, and i also think that their company is full of knowledgeable researchers that can have the same swoop’s reasoning. Have faith guys..
Sorry for my bad english
I think they clearly do not share swoops reasoning. Nor do I. And I refuse to get into a pissing match with him or anyone else. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and can do plenty of reading on their own and come to their own conclusions. We all want the same goal on this: the ability to grow hair back effectively.
This quote carries heavy weight in the medical field in my opinion: “PAST PERFORMANCE DOESN’T ALWAYS INDICATE FUTURE RESULTS”. It hasn’t even been 14 years since the human genome was fully sequenced (2003). The first obvious observation was involvement of androgenic hormones. An enormous amount of knowledge has been gained sense. Add to this better access to sharing that knowledge (internet explosion) and better science and insight into bodily pathways, and we are right on schedule on finally beating this.
Last comment I’ll add before I go off to study for the evening.
Do you guys truly think that Walker just took this as a complete stab in the dark hoping that it would work for AGA? His company is valued at hundreds of millions. There is no way behind the scene knowledge/data hasn’t been shared. I’m telling you guys right now…. stuff has obviously gone on behind the scenes with this in regards to AGA. And you could have assumed as much when the rights were sold to him in the first place. I find it hard to believe that they or someone they had access to haven’t at all either tested this on actual patient(s) or on androgenic hair in culture. Something has happened. And they raised funds quickly and have absorbed two smaller companies specializing in JAK/STAT medicine. And then he said it works topically for AGA, but it didn’t work orally. I don’t think that was a misspeak. He didn’t say how well it worked, but did say that it worked topically.
Cristiano and Clyne’s patent is from 2012/2013
Some time has since past obviously. They must’ve been heading in this direction research wise I’m sure by at least 2010-2012 at the latest.
I’m not trying to hype everyone up just saying that obviously things are looking really good on this. Add in reading about the actual science behind some of the molecules and linked pathways behind AGA, the hair follicle in general, it’s associated genes, differences in populations gene profiles and commonality of AGA among them (Ar is monomorphic among Asians but they still lose hair, starting 10 years later on average), their association with AGA, and their associated disorders (Prostate cancer, BPH, Parkinson’s disease, etc), I find it hard to not get excited in light of yesterday’s quote.
I have not had time to follow the science, but one thing I disagree with “Swoop” on is his citing Dr. Cotsarelis from several years ago. There is a good chance Cotsarelis will downplay the JAK/inflammation angle…he is heavily heavily invested in many other areas of research, including via stakes in several companies if I recall.
In any case, Cotsarelis has been renowned for several decades in the hair loss research world, but we are still waiting for his work to come to fruition. Great to see Dr. King, Dr. Christiano and now Aclaris involved in JAKs for androgenic alopecia.
Could not have said it better. He has a vested interest in his product working in comparison to the others. There have also been times when swoop has tried to downplay Cotsarelis in the past regarding pgd2 and others. Furthermore, I haven’t really done much in regards to swisstemples and his blog, but he called out swoop(ing) on there saying he was ratted out on some private forum a while back trying to push drugs for Kane, who is a guy a lot of “group buyers” get their experimental stuff from. So in light of that I really don’t pay much attention to him anymore.
If you want to say “Cots said this won’t work”
Please be my guest and look at the following article
I am going to copy and paste a DIRECT QUOTE from the above article from Cotsarelis:
If you don’t believe me open it up and read it.
[If ruxolitinib could be applied topically , Dr Cotsarelis said, “This would be an amazing breakthrough.” Until then, “patients are going to rush in demanding this treatment, and I would not give it.”]
So there you have it.
We are a community now?
@john Jack, lmao!!! Great reply:-)
I love how any time there is a post that mentions JAK the comments section blows up! The hype is strong here, I hope things work out.
LOl so true. But this one got me very excited too.
Hype may be great for the hair
I do not think people on this board actually believe that they will have all of their hair again and soon (within 5 years probably sooner).
The photos of that young woman with AA and went from Bald to Full Hair was incredible. Only the recent discovery of JAK was able to give her hair otherwise she would be completely bald.
Now it is OUR turn. Just like her photos our BALD spots will soon be a thing of the past. We will spend our time combing our hair, and styling it into different styles.
Can’t wait for the first AGA photos although might not be for another year.
I am committed to trying to get The Treatment ASAP but that means 1-2 years from now. Although I can only buy it once it becomes available.
I just hope they do not drag this whole thing out 5 years.
Can you imagine the Initial demand. How are they going to sell 200 million tubes of the treatment? That is a lot. The demand unbelievable.
My main course, is to get it for the Other Medical Purposes when it comes out for AA type hair loss but use it for AGA.
Maybe Japan can speed it up to only 2 years.
Nasa! You think jak is the real cure ? And why?
Lopo – I am like everyone else. I really will not believe it until I see it. However I do see this 100% hair for this woman with AA type hair loss.
As far as Male Pattern Baldness it appears, too many reasons to state, that it does work.
I think our biggest hurdles now are the following:
When can we get the lotion?
And, how much will it cost?
Especially the cost since the lady was paying $3,500 for a month’s supply. What did they do make it out of gold. Wait even Gold would be cheaper, seriously.
Hey guys sorry I was in Vegas this whole week haha. Just read the new post. We all know Christiano has tested this Jak on mpb. I am 100% confident that it works very well to restore growth. I just need to see before after pics before I get my hopes up. Seen many claims over the years but I have a lot of faith in Jak so I have my fingers crossed. Only concern is that they take the typical 8 to 10 years of trials to get this out to market. On a side note I need to thank the admin for my game last night at the club. I read the post and my confidence was through the roof. I ended up taking the cocktail waitress home from club Light in Vegas to my hotel room because my game was on fire :) :) Confidence plays a huge role boys. Remember that!
Welcome back mjones, and please limit the women/sex/getting ripped/premature ejaculation posts…I deleted several of those before FYI in case you were wondering where they went.
Didn’t even notice you deleted them. I just I took her back to my room. We just played chess ;) Your post gave me the confidence my man so it’s your fault hahaha OK I won’t I mention that stuff again.
Do you have any more info on follicum? Jak is the main focus bit these are players are way ahead in terms of trials so hopefully we will have another treatment like follica, follicum, brontzu or Histogen in the mean time.:)
After this week, I hope to limit the JAK coverage for a bit:-) So many comments trouble me and distract me from my real work lol
On the other hand too few comments make me feel like I wrote a not so useful post.
I contacted Follicum 3 months ago. This was their reply:
Our treatment will not generate new hair follicles – this requires a totally new treatment regime that unfortunately does not yet exist. The hair follicle is extremely complicated and composed of a number of different cell types including a muscle and a gland. Therefore it is unlikely that one compound can generate a fully functional hair follicle unit. All our follicles are present at birth and no new ones are created during our life. We think our treatment can modulate the hair follicle to either stimulate hair or inhibit hair growth depending on which of our compounds we use. It is too early to speculate on the long-term effects. We are now performing a clinical trial on one of our compounds and the results are expected in the end of 2016. We are very excited about the outcome of this study.
Very interesting opinion thought they were done for
Egghead thank you for using my screen name haha illuminati definitely have a say if Jak gets released lol
Haha welcome back lots a good news since we been gone
Nasa, what do you think of that science stuff Swoop posted over on hlt explaining why he doesn’t think jak will work for aga? He even said the hype around it has been clownish.
And about the girl with AA… she had to take two tablets a day and when she stopped taking them her hair fell out again. She stopped after 7 months, presumably because of the enormous cost of this drug.
So even if it did work for aga, a) it would only work as long as you took it and b) the cost would put it out of reach of 95% of people.
Sorry I am not going go through the stuff that someone posted on other boards,. Also, I am not a scientist. And I am not going over each of the points.
But It Did WORK on the girl – 100%.
But, Dr. Christiano licensed her formula to Aclaris who is testing it on AA AND AGA for hair loss. If you are doubtful wait until Aclaris announces the results of their tests in less than 12 months (probably 6 months as they report their concert call every quarter to investors and have to release significant news). Then you will know for sure. If I am wrong you can tell me so. At worse all you have to do is wait ~6 months.
As far as the cost. I think the lady stated $3,500 for 60 tablets (a month’s supply). That is incredibly expensive.
Hopefully, if they go from making thousands of bottles of the formula to tens of millions of tubes of lotion I would think they could substantially drop the price if they want to sell the product. As an example they lost that lady as a customer.
We can just take one major hurdle at a time. I think it would have been easier to build a Warp Spaceship than to solve AGA.
ADMIN: have you seen this?
Yes thanks Ty, it was posted on HLT ( http://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/showthread.php/99322-RiverTown-Therapeutics-(tested-in-animals-and-on-seven-humans-with-AGA ), but I think I will only include it in my next “brief items of interest” post in a week.
Lol admin….guys im happy we continue to grow in hair science however we have been down this road far too many times so my advice is dont get too excited. If you were to take out the name “Jak” and insert replicel you would think you were reading posts from two years ago. And like a few mentioned, if this does come to fruition, it will take YEARS. And one last thing, do you really want to play with cancer killing T cells? Im more hopeful for cots in two years and getting boosts from histogen because that is far more realistic in the next few years.
Replicel NEVER had this type of result. From Bald to complete Hair, perfect. She does have type AA and not AGA but now it is our time.
But nasa he said the results on aga seem interesting …. He didnt say full regrowth…
He said it’s interesting THAT the topical works(!!!), but systemic doesn’t.
Yup.. he said WORKS.. and this stuff is effective to say the least :-)
Susana – Nice find.
I wonder if AGA will soon have the same issues more competitors coming into the field with JAK solutions. That would be nice.
I am confused here…if you follow this link about an alopecia areata case study using JAK inhibitors topically, they mention that the patient had partial scalp regrowth topically but regained total scalp regrowth when they switched to systemic use:
“For this study, the patient applied the cream twice a day to the scalp and eyebrows. After 12 weeks, she had complete restoration of eyebrows and partial regrowth of her scalp. After switching from the cream to a pill form to continue her treatment, the patient now has a full head of hair.”
I am very confused because I thought the topical formulation was supposed to be MORE effective than the pill???
For AA, systemic > topical. For AGA/MPB, topical > systemic
because “the target being more superficial in the skin and not really accessible from a systemic circulation.”
Ok that makes more sense to me. Thank you for clarifying!
If I recall correctly from that case, the conclusion was that the topical worked the same as systemic at each corresponding time point. However, for some reason, they decided to finish up the regrowth process with systemic (not sure why)
Thank God for JAK inhibitors and the recent good news about their potential. My concern is, why does Dr. Christiano still wear a wig if these drugs work so well?
I was excited too yesterday, but…
$3500 per month, not everyone will respond well, potentially huge health consequences, and at least 5 years away from market.
I’m not holding out any real hope for it. Even if it does come to market, I really wonder about suppressing the immune system with this. I’m holding out for follicum.
Dude, once it gets out to mass market and is approved for AGA it’s going to cost nowhere near $3500, and insurance may even cover it.
Really? Pretty sure insurance doesn’t cover cosmetic issues
It should still be far less expensive once it goes mainstream.
But, some people’s insurance can for example subsidize Dutasteride even when it’s prescribed off-label for hair loss and not BPH. It depends on the insurance.
there is a hardship program where they give it out for free.
I know that Martin Shkreili does that with his drugs too… over 75% ofhis inventory is given away free…. so there might be hope… i dunno
I do know some alopecia forum members refer each other through the hardship program’s tofacitinib via the production company itself… forgot what company owned it.. Allergan? I dunno
Mass production will make it affordable! Besides, arent they developing there own sort of JAKS? Maybe those are more affordable as well. Its a commercial business, the market is too small for too expensive producs.
Really $3500 per month for topical JAK it supresses the immune system too? … man 3500 is real steep for me. That’s like 40k a year.
Is this a comments haul record?
I will name my son jak lol
Side effects after systematic absorption.
Only 50% regrowth?
I believed in NASA & supported on his enthusiasm in last year when he first claimed jak will be the ultimate cure. I still do believe it. Hope we will get our hair back very soon. Inshallah.
Don’t JAK inhibitors also block A5R topically since they are enzyme blockers too? Or am I completely mistaken
I lost my hair because I took Prozac, Risperidone and Concerta during many years at very high doses.
I stopped everything the drug since two years but the fall has never ceased.
My hair are almost all fallen and those remains are too thin to be grafted . Anyway, the little that remains will fall equally.
It’s a nightmare.
Nothing in my family has a genetic alopecia. I’m a good genetic.
I have a contact to give JAK inhibitors. My contact write to me:
« I do not know if I’ll get you is serious. To you to decide.
***** said he may have Tofacitinid 5mg for $ 100 and DMSO as 100 mg for $ 100 plus + .Taxe transportation is $ 40. What would make about $ 270 for 1 month of treatment.
Mix and apply on scalp to 2 days. 3-month trial.
Do not forget that the Tofacitinid cures psoriasis which is an infringement of the immune system as your hair loss drug.
To you to see if it is worth it with what you know about the subject. For the rest contacts assures that are related to laboratories that they predict a coming revolution in the treatment of baldness. His laboratory makes no creams or other for baldness, but manufactures ingredients controlled by these laboratories. That’s why they are aware of what is coming in the future.
I forgot … as were lab products the concentration of 5 mg may be higher, up to 15 mg … which would be for the best … I will quickly restores news … »
What do you think? Do you believe that the assays that are offered to me will be effective for me?
No, I highly doubt a drug currently priced at 3,500 a month is available to you for $ 100 /month. However, maybe you could buy a month’s supply and get it tested. If it’s legit though, I would be interested.
On a side note, I just think it is criminal that these huge pharma companies get away with charging around 3,000 dollars a month for these drugs. It’s INSANE!! It must be especially tough for people with AA who have lost/are losing hair everywhere and this drug can completely change their life and is out there, but these greedy companies are too preoccupied with making a dollar. So much corruption…
I have a discount and it is in Canadian dollar.
hmm.. it is possible. If I were you, I would get a month’s supply or sample, get it verified for legitimacy and give it a go. I can’t wait to get my hands on some and start…
My contact is my father. The touch of my father ‘s best friend. The contact of the best friend of my father is secret laboratory. I do not think we are trying to rip me off . This is a serious laboratory and the people who are the intermediaries between me and the lab are not crooks. So it is not enough to have the right dosage and the right to ingredients cream hope that it works while considering my type of alopecia .
ok, so give it a try then
I love this site, what I meant is don’t be too optimistic, it’s not good for health! No one of us knows when the cure is there, keep that in mind. And admin great site, thx!
can anyone list out the progress of histogen and follica too
Hostogen phase 3 next month. Possible release in Mexico in late 2017.
Follica completing a trial next month possible release in USA 2018. 100cm2 scalp hair coverage :)
100cm2 would be insane. In fact they say 3/4 of those are neogenic (probably tiny) and 1/4 are terminal (possibly thin). I hope I’m wrong and they deliver 15-20 new terminal hairs per cm2. Total scalp surface area is 600cm2 so 15×600 = 9000 new terminal hairs.
But Cot’s saying that a full cure is still “many years away” leads me to think the 100cm2 and even 25% terminal figures are marketing guff from PureTech.
Opinion, don’t go crazy man.. just wait..
Mjones, you said Follica are completing a trial next month? Do you mean next year?
Yes sorry next year not month.
I say we all just take a step back, not make any assumptions and let the researchers at aclaris work their magic and see if they can produce massive regrowth with this jak stuff. Better to be calm and then ecstatic when this stuff is truly proven to work than to be all ecstatic and happy to only be disappointed with Rogaine hair growth results.
Will the curse finally be over holy shit, I feel like crying
Any news on SM? Did they abandon ship on their treatment after phase 2b?
If sm believes alcaris can do what they say, it might be lights out for samumed. They can prob not produce anything near what jak/alcaris is claimimg
I’ve got a question about future hair regrowth methods.
So imagine one of these companies comes up with a way to grow new hairs. I’m thinking guys like follica or riken maybe.
What would happen to the existing thin hair? Yes so there would be new hairs around it, but the thin hairs would still be there.
Would it look strange or odd to have a mix of new thick hairs together with thin hairs?
Am pretty sure once evidence of a cute. The formula will be copyed around the world. Some rich dictator isn’t going to wait ten year’s! Haha pity south korea Kim ain’t bald. He sure as he’ll would of done us a favour
10,000 new hairs is still good from follica even if it means only 25cm2 coverage . We still don’t know what neogenic hair is. Could be slightly thinner than terminal but it still enough to provide good density.
man, from where you get that? why you presume that it’s 25 or 30 or whatever?? or which amount is terminal or not, this is insane!
Off course when this is out it’s gonna be great, they’re not working very silently on this sh… to yield some hairs that will be barely noticeable. c’mon give it a break!
Hey Julian I’m getting the 25 to 100cm2 coverage from follica presentation pdf document. It’s not a made up figure. It stated 25 terminal and 75 neogenic hairs. I want everyone to stop assuming I made this up. Just Google the presentation business plan from follica pure tech and stop saying I made this number up.
I might be wrong, but I think that maybe we’ll be able to mix our own jak + vehicle and use in ourselves in less than a year. We know the name (jak) of the drug, we need to know maybe some basic information like what’s the vehicle and then some people will be doing their own medication… Just wondering, of course risking our health but…
you will risk going bankrupt since other people tell that for AA patients the jak treatment costs 3.5k dollaridos per month
I think we totally should. Get our minds together, maybe someone with a pharma degree/BIO major can provide some insight into vehicles to use in order to create a solution that will penetrate the skin, but not go systemic and start testing.
I agree, surely the scientists on this page can collaborate and come up with the appropriate vehicle to deliver it? We know the justification for why it works, and we have access (through William) to the drug, so I don’t see why we can’t take matters into our own hands.
Hey, first-time poster, long-time lurker. Cautiously optimistic like most of you, but as somebody else said, if you “follow the money” it makes a lot of sense that Aclaris is onto something BIG here. I suspect we’ll see an AA treatment announced in the next 6-12 months — no question on its efficacy there…. followed by more rumors about its efficacy on AGA. Fingers crossed!
My question is, if JAK inhibitors like tofa and rux have already been FDA approved, does that mean they can skip all the clinical trials and approval for a topical AGA treatment? How soon could we actually see something on the market? Is it possible they’ve already been going through trials for AGA and they’ve just been keeping the results under wrap?
I’m not super familiar with how that stuff works. But I would imagine that since it is an already approved drug it should speed things up. However, it did take a decade (or longer) to turn topical minoxidil into minoxidil foam. So we know the FDA is capable of making this a torturous wait.
If however the 21st century cares act gets passed, it should definitely help speed the process up.
We still don’t know if jak will work for aga and people are already celebrating. Come on people !
I think he pretty much insinuated it does in the quote. We don’t know how well yet though. It doesn’t even work 100% in AA. I think they need to perfect the delivery of the JAK/stat inhibitor to get near 100% success rate. They may also develope something other than Ruxolitinib or tofacitnib (there are already others like baracitinib in clinical trials) to more specifically target the pathway they are looking at, i.e. they may want to specifically target stat3/(stat5?) and the JAK receptors they play on the most rather than trying to shut down the entire local immune system.
Good times coming for psoriasis, vitiligo and RA patients too
I wish them all the best
I hope the 100 hairs per cm2 isn’t some bullcrap half-truth written up by some Pure Tech intern. I bet if we asked Cots he’d be like ‘we don’t know’.
I just want another product. Any damn product.
Amen to that Tom! I’m tired of the wait. 16 years and waiting. It’s kind of ridiculous and now that I’m losing ground, it’s a kick in the balls and a huge tease to see all these companies take forever to be released. We should have had at least 3 new fda hair loss drugs all these years. Even if it worked Ike Rogaine or Propecia. Having other options would be nice since our bodies build up tolerance to drugs
Lots of eyeballs on this site
We have some leverage with acrs and others
possible q and a session
Half the eyeballs will disappear soon till the next JAK breakthrough lol But I get your point. Maybe I should call more companies…but unfortunately I have other work at least 30 hrs a week.
My eyeballs are here everyday and all day regardless. :)
Lol mine too
What I don’t get is why there aren’t a few balding billionaire Saudis dropping millions into the most promising hair research labs like Penn or the Chinese labs.
Thats a good question, rich Russian are balding as well I mean all around the world ;)
Hey guys this is great news and it seems like we are taking small steps towards success. However let us not get ahead of ourselves. I think it would be good to leave our expectations for this drug at 50/50. We don’t know it’s potency and how much hair it will grow back yet, it’s cost, timescale for release or it’s potential side effects. Let’s just take it as it comes, that would save us from disappointment.
Thank you admin for your work as always and nasa for your enthusiasm and positivity.
Because they don’t care enough about hair loss
Also, if I was worth billions, I truly believe I would care far less about hair loss lol. Especially if I was older
Very true! Burlusconi was a bit of an exception. The entertainment industry is where you should look, but entertainers only make up a small percentage of billionaires.
These Januse kinase inhibitors are expensive, and I doubt insurance will pay for them.
Also, wanted to add that DS laboratories refunded me for my integra (astressin-b) tablets that I recently purchased from them, and said that the medication will only be available to the international market, as here in the US it is not FDA approved…I offered to sign a disclaimer but they said they couldn’t do that.
Thanks for that interesting information Phil!
Hey Phil, I remember a while back you mention you were trying CO2 Rice Bran Extract, how is that going?
The rice bran supercritical CO2 extract is a work in progress. Will be sure to post an update in another month
isn’t this a first to market wins? if jak comes out in a year and people retain hair and grow back x%, wouldn’t that pretty much put histogen and the rest out of business?
so wouldn’t it be true that all these companies are racing to release something?
if jak worked for me and i wasn’t losing hair and i grew back a bunch of hair, i wouldn’t be interested in hist. a year or so later.
True, but price differences and side effect differences would mean a number of treatments could each capture different segments of the market.
I think I’ve mentioned before that I am a healthcare worker and I work in an academic medical center. I have held all of the janus kinase inhibitors in my hand, most of the injections are kept in the frig. I’ve also looked at the pricing for this stuff, and a hair transplant may be less expensive. These medications are mostly used for autoimmune diseases and unless MPB becomes recognized by health insurance companies as an autoimmune disease, then most hair loss sufferers will be unable to afford these.
It’s kind of like harvoni which cures HCV, but the WAC is $30,000 for a month supply, the hospital gets this drug at 340b pricing (discount pricing for poor patients). The patients who qualify for 340b often have a copayment of $0 but I have seen $3.00 before. I can’t quote how much the hospital pays for harvoni under 340b, but the drug companies are the players that get screwed in 340b pricing (a drug company must sell their drugs at 340b pricing when applicable or the FDA won’t approve new medications that come out). The whole point of the harvoni example is that there is a cure for hepatitis c, but not everyone qualifies for 340b pricing and you can bet your a** that harvoni is not made as widely available as it should be. Hence, a MPB cure or very potent treatment that only need be applied intermittently or via pulse dosing will be extremely pricey, and unfortunately will never be covered under 340b.
“Will never be covered under 340b either”*
If it comes out as a treatment for aga it will be lower. Not saying it will be super cheap but really… If they can’t find a cheaper way to manufacture this drug then the profits of commercializing will be lost. Sufferers are fickle when it comes to a treatment as well. It needs to be novel and cost effective or else many will deem it as useless. In other words, if a treatment that needs to be applied everyday or regularly is more expensive than a hair transplant, people with that money would most likely go with the ht. A one time bang vs a treatment that would bleed you dry is an obvious choice for most people.
That along with the fact that much more people will want the stuff. My guess is that initially it would be somewhat expensive because of the demand but as it settles prices will become within reach/ nominal.
Really well said. You better believe that if this works effectively for AGA it isn’t going to be cheap. Not sure if we’d be looking at quite the enormous price of >3000 per month because huge demand will drive this down to an extent, but you are still looking at paying IMO at least 4 figures every couple of months. So the point admin made about capturing different parts of the market applies as well.
While I don’t think it will be what we describe as cheap, I can’t imagine it being over $1000 every month. Again that would limit the market to a very small percentage or people that would take it. Even the people in my life that I would describe as rich would most likely decide that it isn’t cost effective (there is a reason most of them got rich in the first place – they are very smart with their money).
At that price, in the first 5 years of taking the medicine, the person would have spent $30,000 (this is a price that I would expect someone comfortable paying for a lifetime of treatments, propecia, HT, JAK or otherwise). At that price you could have gotten multiple hair transplants with some top notch doctors. And then that price reoccurs every 5 years for the rest of your life – starting at around 30, that would be near $200,000 in your 60’s.
There are people that are willing to pay that but my guess is that most of us wouldn’t. The company would ultimately lost out on a huge market and with that major profits. In other words, if they can only access 10% (that is probably too high but we are using it for this example) of the market because of pricing you will still have profits but really you are missing out on the much larger profits if it is accessible to everyone. In the US that would be 4 million (10%) people compared to 40 million (100%). With the $1000/ every other month price you gave me at 4 million people = $24B/ Year. If they can get the price to 1/3 of that, making it more accessible to everyone (I don’t know if that is really the price point that everyone can afford) = $80B/ year for the company. Mathematically it doesn’t make sense for them to charge so much and make it inaccessible to the hair loss community.
Just some thoughts.
JJ please use some common sense. Jaks will not be available in a year. As a matter of fact neither will follica. All this hype about two years for follica is b.s..
There is no date on that article…
No date on that article. Meanwhile, the actual 2015 annual report states that Follica’s treatment will be out in 2018 (bar any delays).
Please do your reading.
This is good news. Now I’m curious if this can offer full regrowth? Would the treatment involve a combination of jak and wounding? How much would it cost? I just hope this mpb curse is finally brutality murdered in cold blood, like it deserves to be.
hey tom, maybe think a little… i was making an example, if they are out in a year or 2 or 10 doesn’t matter, my point is first to market. read before you comment
Hey tom, thanks for the link. I was sure that follica will bring a great treatment but did not know that will take 4 to 5 years. Thats no good :/
I believe that Follica article by John Carroll is from 2008 when they received $5.5M and then another $11M from their series A. If not, then it is awful coincidental.
Emerging Drug Developer: Follica | FierceBiotech
FierceBiotech › special-report › emergin…
Mobile-friendly – Follica starts with a market in search of a therapy Most biotech companies start … The hair follicle won. … a group that included George Cotsarelis at the University of Pennsylvania, Rox … Jun 08, 2016 …
Sorry JJ. Im just very frustrated and not happy right now.
I never trust in Follica….Is a joke company. Always delays…and delays. Of course, that’s good news for another companies! :) hehe…
It’s from 2008. Calm down guys.
Guys honestly right now the only thing that might have some potential is JAK other than that I think everything is just bull shit…they dont have any thing…I am not saying they are not trying but i am pretty sure they dont have anything…i dont even know what some guys are talking about 100 hairs per cm…whatever…as if its on the product label…..honestly dont be on edge for any product…bcos you would be disappointed if it doesn’t come out… if there is something it would be on good morning news where a middle aged hottie drinking coffee will say ” Is this the cure for baldness… stay tuned..”
Farhan, the only company to be on Good Morning America and other news outlets and medical shows was Follica. DR COTS was on it back in 2009 and was being interviewed by a top US Medical expert and they said by 2012 they would have completed the protocol of wounding and preclinical and clinical trials. They went through some issue in 2013 from what I remember but pure tech came in and helped due to the potential their treatment will have. It takes years for a new drug or procedure to come out. So please stop trashing follica. They are the only ones right now that have been mentioned by top news stations, media etc. They will have something good. Don’t understand some of your mentality on here at times. It’s like you want follica to fail because cots isn’t releasing pictures or confidential data. The man is smart and to the point. He released the 100cm2 coverage data and a mini graph how the wounding treatment will be done. What more do you guys want? Him to give up his intellectual property. Let him do his thing. I’m excited about follica. I’m not expecting a cure but a damn good replacement to HT.
I have also advocated that it work for AGA. Check my posts on various forums.
Also Christiano knew it worked. Further for some odd reason I think CHRISTopher01 is Dr. Christiano. The pill works too but that would make the price of the pill drop and we wouldn’t want that, insurance can cough that up but the lotion will be cheaper but not covered by insurance so it needs to be affordable for the average (middle class) person at some point.
I have seen on first had experience that it works!!!!!!!!!!!! And even on women! AGA is an autoimmune disease! End of story ! Let get it on market or have some Chinese guy knock it off lol
MPB is an autoinmune/androgenic disease….interesting…very interesting.
The first thing that comes to my mind when I hear the term JAK inhibitors is psoriasis/psoriatic arthritis. Likewise, the hair on your scalp, and everywhere else on your body is part of the largest organ of the human body, the integumentary system (which also happens to be your first line of defense against pathogens). What purpose does our hair serve? Yes, losing it is emotionally taxing and probably drains millions if not more dollars out of our economy due to decreased productivity and/or depression experienced by AGA suffers, especially here in the USA since we live in a very superficial society. If a healthcare provider can convince insurance companies that AGA is an autoimmune disease then future treatments would be a lot more affordable.
Going off of this, what does AGA mean? That androgens (DHT) are the sole cause of our hair loss? I doubt it….
Yes this year will get a complete cure for sure….. Rigth? XD
I’m sure Opinion works in HT field.
Yes Phil Collins the etiology of MPB must be changed…
Thanks lewa for the correction, I got kind of scared though lol
Wish I could go back and find my comment when I said this was the calm before the storm.. A new company is actually in a phase se two trial for their compound.. It’s called river town therapeutics
Do you have a link to the actual presentation?
You bet https://mybio.org/event/member/271808
I see the intro but no presentation… am I missing something?
Are they using a JAK inhibitor also?
Tsuji might be the only hope but it’s too far and haven’t been any updates from Tsuji.
Very uneducated in the hair loss world I see
yes Tsuji only hope there is unlimited and permanent hair hope in
No update is good news :(
can someone tell me why there is so much hype? AGA is completely different than Alopecia right?
completely different treatments are applied for different reasons to the same organ. e.g. stomach has gastritis , reflux…etc as such. even though the area in scope is stomach, there are many different diseases and types and treatments.
u all saying one size fits for all… any proof that actually works for AGA?
if it comes to saying no but he is knowledgeable man in hairloss industry. sorry but i dont buy that. Almost every quarter a company jumps and declares they have found the cure… why should we believe only words?
6 months ago Replicel also claimed they found the cure. since then nobody heard anything…
Alopecia is always alopecia….remember that.
Guys, the possible cure or very good treatment, holy grail of hair loss exist. Check the proteasome inhibitors. Especially PSI. If you can get the real PSI from good lab you are probably save.
ALOPECIA IS ALOPECIA: “androgenetic” ALOPECIA. It’s easy. The etiology of MPB is unknown DHT isn’t the main cause 100% sure. The hype? It’s easy too. People with “AGA” want new treatments because are unhappy with current treatments: Minoxidil and Finasteride give very poor results and a lot of side effects. And hair transplants are very expensive and not always give you awesome results…. In conclusion: Hair loss industry needs to IMPROVE as soon as possible.
not a reply to my question. my question is why there is hype on JAK? any proof that actually works on AGA besides claims and words… any photo? or scientific evidence….
we dont believe in words anymore.. everyone claims they have the cure and right after went into silence and disappear …
how can you assure that they do it just to increase their stock price?
No. Nobody used in AGA. Lets hope this year any lab try it. I will happy if next year the drog be aproved for AA. They have unsurense so will be more profit for this labs.
Good things and good treatments take time…of course, they have some evidence and new data: JAK inhibitors works for “MPB” in humans.
But IMO i don’t think that JAK inhibitors will be a cure. Maybe a good treatment but not a cure.
Looking at at AA results it seems like a cure fot it, hope it will be same for AGA. We can just hope right now, God please help!
Hair industry is a shame
People please dont be so exited about. If you read some AA foruns the AA people are not só exited like us. This treatment is no 100% in all. In some cases they use a get Good result in other 0. And the treatment is over expensive. If they stop the jak they lost all Gain. There are some hope Yes. But nothing is proved.
Hopefully NASArs and ADMIN will catch this… quite interesting. Others my find this interesting as well.
I’ve already posted a bunch of stuff above (and on other write ups) about Stat3 and AGA etc… One specific thing I posted which I find very interesting is the roll of Stat3 in keratinocyte mitochondria. You can find that link near the top of this post. Hair shaft itself is made up of keratin. Lowering/eliminating this rescued some of the cells nuclear metabolic genes (genes from the nucleus of the cell… not mitochondrial genes), and rescued mitochondrial (main cellular energy source) function. One of these genes is NRF1 which interestingly is involved in cellular metabolism. We already think that obviously the hair follicle’s metabolism of more powerful androgenic hormones than testosterone is the primary difference in those with AGA and those without.
Under “Biological Process” one of the things listed under this was “Organ regeneration” in regards to the NRF1 gene.
Then I found this awesome write up:
This is in neurons, not hair follicles, but is still very interesting. 12/15 Lipoxygenase targets neuronal cells MITOCHONDRIA under oxidative stress. We know oxidative stress is what is going on in androgenic follicles from the inability to properly metabolize androgenic hormones stronger than testosterone. This creates ROS. Furthermore, the article mentions 12/15 Lipoxygenase mitochondrial deregulation as being a factor in Parkinson’s disease, and there is a big link between premature AGA and risk of developing Parkinson’s disease later in life from a somewhat recent genetic study.
Then I found this article:
12/15 Lipoxygenase contributes to PDGF activation of STAT3, and that 12/15 Lipoxygenases are crucial by-products of ROS (Reactive Oxygen Species ) something we know is rampant in AGA follicles because of their genetic inability to properly metabolize DHT. The article then talks about how genetic or pharmacological (medicine) interference with a 12/15 Lipoxygenase inhibitor prevented STAT3 phosphorylation.
So why is this all interesting? Who remembers the Benoxaprofen articles that admin posted? It talked about the case studies of two men who had AGA and who took Benoxaprofen for other things and regrew hair in same density as before… Well the primary purpose of Benoxaprofen is as a LIPOXYGENASE INHIBITOR. So no ability to make Lipoxygenase means no ability to make Lipoxygenase 12/15 which means no ability of this pathway to respond to ROS and activate STAT3 via PGDF. You can wiki “Benoxaprofen” and find that info under “Toxicodynamics” and follow the link to the British Medical Journal if you wish. This is a big difference from other NSAID’s in that it directly targets single nuclear cells. Remember, this drug was only approved for a very short time before being pulled from the market because of deaths.
Once again, you can tie another big link to STAT3 on this mystery.
Something also random…
I believe I’ve posted this one before, but wanted to add something to this. This talks about miRNA-22 being a key player in hair loss. It silences over 50 keratin distinct genes and that silencing of those genes is a prerequisite for actively growing follicles to regress (just like in AGA).
So here is where I’m going with this…
If you click on the “gene ontology” tab on the right hand side of the page, and then scroll down to “Biological Process” and look at the 7th bullet point down from the top: “Positive regulation of gene silencing by miRNA”….. So once again perhaps STAT3 is a path directly allowing this 50+ keratin specific gene silencing to happen via miRNA22.
Maybe you can tell us what your thoughts are concerning the scalp pain / itch a lot AGA sufferers experience in relation to your findings about STAT3.
I found this pubmed article:
Again STAT3 suppression / inhibition is is discussed in this article case. Also the spinal cord is involved when it comes to dermatis and itch.
Although I am not able to dive into the details as deep as you can, I am convinced the JAK inhibitors will be able to solve lots of our issues related to skin and hair.
There will be a time without scalp pain, psoriasis, dermatitis, vitiligo, AA and AGA. Even hair loss caused by chemo may be solved later as soon as the patients body is normalized and is able to handle the JAK/ immuno suppressants.
At the same time, when it comes to grey hair and vitiligo, I think they are the discoloration twins, if you know what I mean. If JAK solves Vitiligo, it solves Achromotrichia as well.
Astrogliosis / reactive astrocytosis
I read: autoimmune response, scar tissue formation
hey Netshed I’m sure this will be ill received by many but after using cayenne, garlic, onion, and apple cider vinegar (blended up and topically applied on my head) with occasional once a week tee tree oil at night my scalp itch and pain has been GONE for months….. it’s all pretty damn cheap too. It is ridiculous, I know.. and If i sweat the smell comes out which makes me feel uncomfortable but I’ve had pain and itchiness for like 5 to 10 years so it’s worth it to me my hairs never felt healthier.
Mat I think there is something to the PH level in the scalp and I hear that apple cider vinegar helps balance that what are your thoughts on acidity and inflammation and demodex/mites etc?
Cliradex Paul S. guy said it was most likely something like blepharitis or demodex. he said to me on the phone “Does is feel like there is a moist goopy layer of itchy skin than peels off like dandruff even if you shower hundreds of times?” -Yes -“okay yeah then that’s probably dixtophgoporcyionaidlititus (some big word) so after that exchange of dialogue I started experimenting with hippy naturals etc. because the Cliradex foam was taking to long to release to market.
me and my twin brother both have observed and questioned why our scalp hurts and feel itchy. It’s definitely NOT placebo. Our AGA does something to cause itching and pain. I’ve been doing this for 2 months no hair regrowth obviously some tiny terminalishvellous hairs here and there but nothing worth the trouble … but no pain or itching either -AT ALL. my scalp feels healthier hair is stronger and softer and it’s never been like this my entire adult life and my girlfriend notices it too she said “it feels stronger”.
I would say the experiment was a total failure so far 60 days in reversing AGA but a total success in stopping whatever the hell the pain and itching problem was.
bet your girlfriend loves the smell of that garlic in your hair…
I confirm that ACV works when it comes to an itchy scaly scalp and face. People who downplay it, never tried it I suppose.
What is really weird about the scalp pain is that it occurs in conjunction with hair loss at the crown and not with hair loss at the temples, at least that is my experience.
This might be in line with what some sufferers report, being that the current (almost useless) treatments have some minor effect in the crown but none in the front zone.
can you take an interview with dr walker?
AND ask if these JAK inhibitors are even economically feasible!…like seriously, if it cost as much as a hair transplant, but you have to continually apply it, it is worthless…from what I see, Oral JAK is very expensive.
I don’t think we should underestimate any of the findings Matt’s presenting in these comments. Some of the links he’s making seem unprecedented, and I only wish I had more knowledge to help him out – I’m reading everything I can to try and catch up!
Interesting line I found on the inflammation angle though:
“A study shows that benoxaprofen, or other lipoxygenase-inhibiting agents, might be helpful in the treatment of psoriasis because the migration inhibition of the inflammatory cells (leukocytes) into the skin”
Keep up the amazing work Matt!
Wow…. look at these articles in relation to all previous posts I and others have posted
There is definitely something to this whole miRNA-22 and JAK/STAT pathway thing going on in hair. In this other cancerous t-cell population it looks like like JAK/STAT pathway is actually supressing miRNA-22. Specifically this article mentions JAK3/STAT3/STAT5…. Notice how Walker talked about developing a JAK3 inhibitor as apposed to the others…
miRNA-22 functions as a “tumor suppressor”. Aka it stunts the growth of cells. The exact thing we are seeing in the actual hair shaft part of the hair follicle in AGA. Difference between AGA and AA? One is an adaptive immune response (AGA) and the other is an innate response (AA). Which explains the different timescales to lose hair, and explains the pattern somewhat. We also know from above posts that STAT3 is a positive regulator of miRNA gene suppression. And it is known that miRNA-22 is androgen induced from previous posts. And you may look this up if you wish, but estrogen/estrogen receptor and androgen/androgen receptor are regulated differently by miRNA-22 in different cancers.
Based off of in human trials and on mice, we know that lowering/blocking of JAK/STAT signaling allows hair to grow. When it is high, it is a stop signal in the hair follicle. That much is obvious. This not only works in rodents but in humans. We also know that miRNA-22 functions in hair to stop it from growing by suppressing 50+ keratin genes (and probably others)…. see above article for that. Causing the follicle to regress according to above posted article… exactly like the parthenogenesis of AGA. Also the miRNA-22 promoter is located on the same DNA region in mice and in humans per the article I posted above.
miRNA22 is also implicated in endothelial cell cellular senescence…. We know this is going on in AGA dp cells, perhaps once again through the JAK/STAT pathway? Relieving this reverses senescence. See the below abstract
Also miRNA-22 regulates smooth muscle cell differentiation. Smooth muscle cell is what the erector pili muscle is made of, in which contact is lost in AGA. Could stopping miRNA-22 jak/stat signaling allow the erector pilli muscle to make contact again? See the below abstract.
Here is where this gets interesting to me….
The gene coding for miRNA-22 is on chromosome 17. And it appears that the genes coding for stat3, stat5a, and stat5b are ALSO on chromosome 17.
Note that stat1, stat2, stat4, and stat6 are not on the same chromosome…. So perhaps this micro RNA is promoting stat3 and stat5 over-expression in AGA.
miRNA’s main function is to post transcriptionally regulate gene expression.
STAT’s stands for “SIGNAL TRANSDUCER ACTIVATOR OF TRANSCRIPTION.” It would only make sense that something like this is the main problem in AGA. It looks super complicated from the outside because so much is going on. But perhaps it is one or two master switches causing the cascade of crap to happen. This is what I believe at least.
Man, I am more confident then ever that proper JAK/STAT inhibition via a topical is truly it. I could be completely wrong, but it sure looks like jak/stat signaling has a ton to do with all of hair biology (really, all of biology in general) not just AA.
U should email Dr Cristiano with your findings.
Only if she gives me a batch of potent topical JAK/stat inhibitor right away lol. I have a feeling she already knows. Don’t forget the research you read is usually 2/3 year behind what these scientists are actually doing. I just think there is no way this hasn’t been tried out yet. They don’t want competitors right on their tail. Plus she studies the genetics behind this all, so I really believe she knows by now. Hell, IMO I think when it’s all said and done maybe this will be MORE effective for AGA than AA bc in AA this all happens rapidly, you are dealing with a forceful attack on the follicles, whereas in AGA it is usually a pretty slow process. Either way I’m quite convinced this is going to nail AGA. Everything looks like it fits on paper. Just need to wait 50+ years to get through the FDA :)
Forgot to mention above, JAK3 is the commonality to both stat3 and stat5a/b. That is why I think they are going to try and target the JAK3 receptor as apposed to the JAK 1 receptor.
Why does it take so long when JAK inhibitors are already FDA approved?
Ha, was making a joke it won’t take 50 years lol. But I think it could take a while. That’s just how it works with FDA trials.
Hehe i know you were joking about 50 but when they have found the right ‘mix’ voor Jak that works. Couldn’t they start mass fabricating it in 2-3 years?
In cots we trust ! He has been working in wound healing since 2005. Infact he established follica after he discovered wounding technique and not established follica to discover the technique. He just knows how to be quite for long time : -)
Yup he will be quite 50 years more and will be quite king…lol
Admin, 427 comments, surely a record?
I’m still surprised that DS laboratories would not sell me their integra product, but if I lived in Mexico I could purchase it…https://dslaboratories.com.mx/producto/integra/
They even have before and after pictures posted on thei Mexico website
Have you ever considered doing Astressin-b injections? The trial on mice was done by injections so I’m assuming doing it orally will do nothing.
When I go to the webshop it states Not For Sale, I live in Europe. So I think it’s blocked for this continent as well.
That’s interesting. Why only Mexico? I truely believe emotional stress plays a role in hair loss, and the corticotropin releasing hormone cascade augments many different physiological systems in our bodies.
I actually trust in DS labs. They make a topical DNC-f7 (topical astressin-b) but I want the PO (Oral) dosage form. My neighbor is a retired dermatologist (went to allopathic US school), and I’ve talked to him about hair loss before. I wonder if he can pull some strings and get me this integra
You could be right. My hair loss started after suffering a significant injury playing baseball. Never had one before and was devastated recovering from it :(
I don’t usually use cnn.com as a source but “light pollution” and an increased stressful and chaotic lifestyle has caused a surge in our cortisol levels.
Admin please make interview with dr Walker
Nasa rs or admin, please answer. Can either of you please tell me if NASA RS is in some way affiliated with the research going into this or is he just a regular guy that’s doing a lot of research?
The timing of the announcement and when he wanted to release his information was uncanny. It makes me think he has inside info
Regarding river town therapeutics, how come they are in phase 2 for AGA product and no one has heard of them? They are claiming regrowth in bald areas…Anyone knows smth?
Riverine is in phase two yet no pics. If I had a money maker your damn well im gonna post pics and watch my stock go up up and away!
So it’s a scam
You guys know nothing about how companies work lol
EVEN more…DS labs Mexico website has a minoxidil 12%/finasteride 1% topical combo. A product that is not available on their USA website, and they have before and after pictures….
Yes the after and before pictures…..
Are still gross eh lol…better off shaving and cleaning up that grease…
How can I get a prescription for JAK? Does anybody know of any websites or doctors that give out prescriptions easily?
Admin, when is the other big post coming?
lol control the weather admin were depending on you don’t let us down
Cant do fin. Cant do minox. Cant do nizoral. Anyone have any suggestions until a new treatment arrives? Fyi im scheduled for prp in a month or so . This blows
Man we need a new treatment asap! This is just getting completely ridiculous and unfair. Don’t these companies have any compassion for our suffering
@mjones … dude if you read my comment properly I was telling people who are in false hopes, that there is nothing that is coming out too soon, I was saying that if something comes out it will be on the news and why some of you think I wanna trash any company..I would be the happiest person if a cure comes out…I am just being practical here…not cursing the companies like you do…so read properly before comment
Admin wanted to post a new article about jak but I think no need for that. Maybe a brief item for june is better ?
Mjones I gotta do it man. Prp..nothing else left.:(
I hope it works well for you tom:)
I’ve read that lauster will launch his treatment (cure) in 2015, is that right ?
Sorry in 2020 :))
Sorry it says 8-15 years :/
If it says 8 to 15 years away I would just completely write it off. Lauster has been in the game since 2001. If he needs another 8 to 15 years then he has jack sht! We shouldn’t even talk about him anymore.
@farhan. I wasn’t responding back to your post. I was just in general complaining how it’s taking forever for a new treatment to come out. I’m losing my patience and hope for these companies.. I have been considering an FUE for my front right half of my hairline where it’s complete diffuse. I have the ugliest pattern loss:(
Dude get a fue… Stop wasting your time.. I doubt even if a cure comes it will be strong enough to grow in the temples.. Only do it from a really good surgeon… I did it and for three years I didn’t even think about hair loss for a day
@farhan… no offense but… if you don’t think about hair loss then why are you here?
@curious ….never mind…I was gonna say something….
Stop advocating for HT, Farhan. You will regret your decision in 15 years. I have met HT recipients, and have read many posts online. I have not seen one recipient who did not regret it 15-20 years later. It starts off fine, if you are lucky, but it does not end well. You still are losing your hair.. and it will continue…
If you have a big a with zero effect from AGA in you donor área FUE is Good alternative. If not you will regret it.
Best solution is shave it and get a Good sun in the head XD nobody will Know you are bald.
Hi Matt , help me please . You seem very knowledgeable. According to your own knowledge, what is the best dosage and the right ingredients to make a cream with tofacitinib . Can you do me a detailed list please . I order the Tofa and ingredients shortly. Thank you. William
Long time lurker, not much of a poster!
For any of you scientists out there (real, armchair or otherwise), do you think there will be an contraindications for JAK treatment for those of us that have been diagnosed with melanoma previously?
I hope this q doesn’t get lost in the replies! This thread is crazy.
Nobody will Know that.
Post your question again in the newest thread the admin posted. I just got off work and we’ll try to answer later in the week. Here are my credentials: I have a BS in Biology, minor in chemistry, am in my 3rd year of pharmacy school, and I work at an internationally known academic medical center.
any idea about when this will be released?
Seems that they have evidence that it works for people with MPB. Watch/Listen the presentation again please.
JUNE 8, 2016 AT 2:14 PM
They said in the presentation that topical JAK inhibitors work for AGA.
Neal Walker needs to provide us with before after pics of jak on mpb! We deserve at least some evidence that it works great. That will boost mine and many other people’s confidence knowing that a great mpb treatment is on its way. Sitting here hearing the same old song and dance with no real picture evidence is brutal waiting and waiting
They dont even have jaks for mpb on their website of drugs in the pipeline, not even the very first step! The people thinking (if it even works or is financially feasible) it will be out any time soon are crazy! This was mentioned where at an investor conference, hoping to get investors and stock upgrades and recomendations from analysts which then cause their stock to appreciate. They can then issue more shares and essentially use their stock as a currency to grow and make aqcuistions and raise capital…the hype over nothing is crazy. hopefully it works and regrows hair, “matt” makes some solid arguements connecting the dots of why it should.
Guest 99 makes a solid point
Something that scientific research companies and very bad at is website management, because they work on funding and don’t waste money on IT people. We know that JAK for AGA is in early stages still, so it’s not surprising to see a lack of info on their website. Look how rarely histogen update theirs for example.
So now this thread ends like every other = it wont see release for the next 10 years. Releax people give them a chance to get everything in order. We just got the next a few days ago. Hopefully we’ll hear more very soon:-)
@matt, Thank you for all the technical insight, its amazing!!
*got the news a few days ago
Matt, what do you think about proteasome inhibitors?
Admin when can we expect some new news related because now this thread has gone in another phase.
Actually in your earlier comments you seem to preparing for some another interesting post and now i am only curious for that. Please release that.
@Admin. Any new updates from histogen? I hope they don’t flake on phase 3 trial next month
Seems to me from the presentation that they already have a compound made up for mpb called RT1640. Sure hope there is a workaround that lets people experiment with it somewhere in the world, maybe with an off label script.
Below is how Dr Christiano describes making the cream in her study.
“Ruxolitinib was purchased from ChemieTek (catalog no. CT-INCB). Tofacitinib was purchased from AbMole BioScience (catalog no. 477600-75-2). Hedgehog agonist (SAG) was purchased from EMD Millipore (catalog no. 566660). JAK-STAT inhibitors were dissolved in DMSO and used at 2 to 3% for in vivo experiments, as indicated, and 400 nM for in vitro experiments. SAG was used at 120 μM, as described by Paladini et al. (2).”
That Good to Know. Somebody in this world will try that
Your post is misleading, it refers to 3 different creams being compared to each other. 1. SHH 2. Rux 3. Tof
When will the product availability in India …..admin can u please tell when will available this !!!!